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Yongnuo & Unofficial HSS

Discussion in 'Panasonic Cameras' started by Cruzan80, Feb 4, 2013.

  1. Cruzan80

    Cruzan80 Mu-43 All-Pro

    Aug 23, 2012
    Denver, Co
    Sean Rastsmith
    Hey All, Looking at getting a flash, and seen great reviews about the Yongnuo 560s. I know they are fully manual, have no TTL, etc. The only "problem" is that the G3 I have has a flash sync of 1/160sec and I dont' think this flash supports HSS/FP mode. I have heard of people saying that in Manual (on the camera) they have been able to get much higher without the curtain really showing at all. Does anyone have one, and a camera which has a 1/160sec sync speed who can do some unofficial testing? From what I have heard, people report up to about 1/325 or so being ok (which also matches with the specs I have found on the full power t0.1 measurement). If not, is there a way to put a fully manual flash into HSS mode, or does it have to have more pin connections with the camera (Oly/Pana or Metz)?

    Any other things to be aware of with these? I have heard of the 560III coming out soon/now, but all I have seen them on is Ebay. I also understand that it is the same shell as the Canon 580 series, so any diffuser/softbox/etc will fit on this, correct? A large part that has me looking at these is price, especially compared to the Metz (looks like the 58 and 560 have the same power output/bounce-swivel angles/etc. but at 1/4 the cost).
     
  2. Cruzan80

    Cruzan80 Mu-43 All-Pro

    Aug 23, 2012
    Denver, Co
    Sean Rastsmith
    Bumping this back up, after the weekend. Anyone else tried anything like this? Even with another camera which has 1/160 sync? I know several people on here have this brand, and seem to like them.
     
  3. RobWatson

    RobWatson Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    I have YN560 and sync on the E-P-1 is pretty close to stated ...

    If I was to 'hack' a manual flash I would build a trigger to pulse repeatedly and rapidly the flash (set to minimum of really low power) and see what it can do.

    Probably not worth the effort but a good learning experience. TTL/HSS flashes for <$200 can be found.
     
  4. jziegler

    jziegler Mu-43 Veteran

    261
    Dec 15, 2012
    Salem County, New Jersey
    James
    I'm watching this thread, as I'd like to know as well. I have some manual flashes and a G3, and even in manual mode, with a flash (or wireless transmitter) attached and turned on, I can't get the shutter speed to go past 1/160. On my Oly E-PL3, I can get to around 1/320. I think that the Panasonic firmware enforces this, where Olympus (and others) will let you go past the sync speed at your on risk.
     
  5. Cruzan80

    Cruzan80 Mu-43 All-Pro

    Aug 23, 2012
    Denver, Co
    Sean Rastsmith
    From what I have read, if you are in M, you can push it past (at your own risk). Is this not correct?
     
  6. elavon

    elavon Mu-43 All-Pro

    Sep 1, 2012
    Tel Aviv Israel
    Ehud
    I have checked this on a G5 and could not pass the 160 in any mode with TTL or manual flash.
     
  7. jziegler

    jziegler Mu-43 Veteran

    261
    Dec 15, 2012
    Salem County, New Jersey
    James
    I'll check again tonight to make sure I really am in M mode (I've normally been using a C2 mode derived from M), but I have not been able to push past 1/160. I really wish that I could, I suspect that the shutter is good for at least a bit more.
     
  8. Cruzan80

    Cruzan80 Mu-43 All-Pro

    Aug 23, 2012
    Denver, Co
    Sean Rastsmith
    Does it make a difference on the flash setting? Aka. if you put it in FP mode, even though it doesn't have it, or change to 2nd curtain sync?
     
  9. jziegler

    jziegler Mu-43 Veteran

    261
    Dec 15, 2012
    Salem County, New Jersey
    James
    I'm not sure that those options are even available with a manual flash. I'll do some playing tonight.

    Regards,
    Jim
     
  10. RobWatson

    RobWatson Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Yes, you can push it but if the camera flash sync is 1/160 then probably can't push much more than 2x that without big trouble. 2nd curtain won't matter.

    HSS/FP is for way faster shutters than that so you will not get there by simple fiddling with settings.

    A DIY circuit between camera hot shoe and flash is needed. Turns your one pulse into a series of pulses that then trigger the flash repeatedly. Use a 555 timer as a clock generator the input is your hot shoe signal and the output is the flash trigger. This will be limited by the flashes ability to cycle quickly. Unless you are into this kind of thing best to just spend ~$120 and get a TTL capable flash.

    Probably safer to hack radio triggers so if things go south you only fry the radio triggers and not your camera and/or flash.

    The fact that there are not such things available for purchase lends me to believe that it is not possible (probably the flash is too slow) or it is simply not cost effective. Sounds like a fun DIY hobby thing 'because it is there' but I bet it will not work nearly as well as a $120 TTL capable flash.
     
  11. SNTP

    SNTP Mu-43 Regular

    126
    Sep 7, 2011
    I have 2 of the Yongnuo 560IIIs and i can tell you that there is the "Multi" feature on these flashes, that allow you to make the flash pulse with up to 100hz btwn the flash (it's a very fast pulse). You can only go up to 1/4 power but it can work for you.
    here's the problem. It does not have a heat cut-off, and I overheated mine and it no longer fires. I was shooting at 1/128th power and had it flash 10 times with 50hz between each of the 10 flash pops. I basically have a dud of a flash now. Proceed with caution when using the feature, or just get a flash that can do high-speed sync like the METZ 50AF-1 flash.
    That said, when used normally like my 560EXIIs, the built-in wireless trigger is such a wonderful addition to the flash. I absolutely love it. I was advised by another photographer that has bought many Yongnuo flashes and equipment in the past that I should wait for at least 4-6 months after the release of a new flash/accessory before buying it from Yongnuo. They are a company that seems to do quality control by RMA instead of internally, and they update and change the way they manufacture the equipment often.
     
  12. jziegler

    jziegler Mu-43 Veteran

    261
    Dec 15, 2012
    Salem County, New Jersey
    James
    There is no FP mode option with a manual flash. 2nd curtain sync appears to have no effect.

    If I turn the camera on with a flash mounted in M mode, set teh shutter speed to 200 or higher, and then turn the flash on, the shutter speed reverts to 160, and turning the dial, will not go any higher.
     
  13. jziegler

    jziegler Mu-43 Veteran

    261
    Dec 15, 2012
    Salem County, New Jersey
    James
    Have you tried this on a Panasonic camera? I can push it on my E-PL1 (and the Nikons that I had before), but the Panasonic G3 will not allow you to push it. I can't confirm on other Panasonic cameras, but they might be the same. When a manual flash is attached and turned on (a radio trigger too), the faster shutter speeds are locked out. I'd really like someone to prove me wrong on this...
     
  14. RobWatson

    RobWatson Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Can't help with Panasonic ... with E-P1 set to manual exposure (or any mode ) I can fire the flash at any exposure time - even 1/4000 sec. I see the shutter at 1/250 and maybe even a slight bit at 1/200 in some cases.

    Nothing is locked out.
     
  15. jziegler

    jziegler Mu-43 Veteran

    261
    Dec 15, 2012
    Salem County, New Jersey
    James
    Similar to the E-PL1. Panasonic obviously decided we shouldn't do things ilke this..
     
  16. Cruzan80

    Cruzan80 Mu-43 All-Pro

    Aug 23, 2012
    Denver, Co
    Sean Rastsmith
    So verdict is that it is a Panasonic thing, and Yongnuo has a quasi option for burst, even though it isn't HSS, and use at your discretion? All good info. Wish Pana. hadn't locked it out, but them's the rules.

    Reason I wasn't looking at something like the Metz 36 is relative power. I would be into closer to the 58, which is a larger difference in price.
     
  17. RobWatson

    RobWatson Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Wait a sec ... 100 Hz is only once every 10 milliseconds so 1/100 sec shutter speed gets only one 'pop'. That is not even faster than the flash sync minimum! For the fastest shutter speeds of 1/4000 one would need a pulse every 1/4000 sec at least and that calls for clocks 4kHz type speeds. Just to be on the safe side (so as not to miss a pulse) speeds more like 10 kHz are in order.