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why I've moved on from four-thirds

Discussion in 'Panasonic Cameras' started by Gorlash, Jul 31, 2016.

  1. Gorlash

    Gorlash Mu-43 Rookie

    24
    Aug 7, 2013
    Fremont, CA
    Most of my core photography takes place when I'm hiking outdoors. Because many of my shots are scenics or wildlife, I've treasured long zoom cameras. however, since I'm often wander on deer trails, or no trails at all, tripods aren't very practical for me, and I found that I was so unsteady with a monopod, that it was no better than hand-held. I've gotten pretty good, though, at crouching down and bracing against things while shooting long zooms.

    Over the years I've used a variety of Lumix and Canon cameras, as well as a couple of others... my most recent consumer-sensor camera was the FZ47. Although I really liked them, I found that the noise in long-zoom shots made them almost useless, especially if lighting was challenged.

    Then I discovered the Lumix G5... WOW!! I had 14-140mm and 100-300mm zoom lenses. The 14-140 was, frankly, rather mediocre, but the 100-300mm was Stupifying!! I could shoot braced-hand-held images at 600mm, and often get razor-sharp images at pixel resolution. I was in derelict heaven!!!

    well, at least at first... after a few months of hiking, though, I found the process of managing all the lenses very awkward in the field. With my large pack, a separate camera pack wasn't very manageable; I tried a belt carrier for the big lens, and actually developed a manageable process for swapping lenses in it while balanced on a hillside, but the belt carrier was *very* bothersome when I was climbing.

    In the meantime, I had another major issue, which was close-up photography... I *really* missed the 1" minimum focus of the consumer cameras; the 14-140mm had about 20" minimum focus, and for bugs and small flowers and such, that just wasn't useful. I got a set of macro rings, and they worked pretty well, so I carried the 14mm around in my pocket, which was fine for flowers, but by the time I could swap the macro ring onto the lens, whatever critter I wanted to capture was often gone.

    So over time, while I still loved the long-zoom performance, I was frustrated by the package as a whole...

    And then I discovered the Lumix FZ1000... with a 1" sensor, 25-400mm zoom range, and 2" minimum focus, it seemed the best of all worlds... I got it about two years ago, and have absolutely fallen in love!! It's images are nearly as good as the G5, especially hand-held long zooms... it has proven itself very robust, which is good because I don't use a camera-body case when hiking, and my cameras *do* get jousted around a fair bit, especially if I'm climbing on soft ground. The macro images are superb!!

    So now I carry the G5 with 100-300mm lens in my pack, and the FZ1000 around my neck; and frankly, the G5 is used less and less as time goes on; the other four-thirds lenses and macro rings stay at home. I suspect I can see a day when the G5 just comes out of the pack entirely. In spite of the magnificent, almost magical long-zoom images that I get with it, the other issues with multi-lens setups just were not worth it to me...

    Wow... this ended up being a long post, hope this isn't tl;dr for too many people...
     
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  2. Phocal

    Phocal Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Jan 3, 2014
    Wow, your 5th post is to say you are leaving.........ok, goodbye..........don't let the door hit ya where nature split ya
     
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  3. Gorlash

    Gorlash Mu-43 Rookie

    24
    Aug 7, 2013
    Fremont, CA
    Well, I didn't say I was leaving the website, just talking my experience with this camera... ??
     
  4. ijm5012

    ijm5012 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Oct 2, 2013
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Ian
    Why don't you sell all the gear and just get a Sony RX10 III? It has the most recent Sony 1" sensor in it, and it has a 24-600mm lens. So instead of needing two cameras, you could consolidate it down to a single camera/lens combo, helping save weight and space in your bag.
     
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  5. Gorlash

    Gorlash Mu-43 Rookie

    24
    Aug 7, 2013
    Fremont, CA
    Cool, I'll look at it... thanks for the recommendation!!
     
  6. Gorlash

    Gorlash Mu-43 Rookie

    24
    Aug 7, 2013
    Fremont, CA
    Okay, I guess people are going to wonder why I even left this post, instead of just leaving the forums behind.
    It is *not* because I found 4/3 useless, I loved the format, but I had problems with it, which I tried to discuss meaningfully.

    I guess I was wishing to start a discussion about these issues, see if others have had the same experiences; presumably others hike with their cameras and have dealt with similar issues, especially juggling multiple lenses effectively. I was hoping to get insights into how other people address these issues, and see how they dealt, or did not deal with them...
     
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  7. Phocal

    Phocal Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Jan 3, 2014
    So why didn't you start a post about that? Making your 5th post ever on the site to say you are not going to be using the µ4/3 system any more is just asking for someone like me to make the post I made. We get so many post like yours where people are just looking to bash µ4/3. Before I made my first post I looked at your other post and not once have you ever asked what other people do in your situation. I would not say making a post saying you are leaving the system and this is why is a way to try and have a meaningful discussion about what you perceive as a problem. If you don't like changing lenses then a camera system built around the concept of interchangeable lenses is probably not for you. No matter what camera you use, you have to make a compromise. Full frame have some of the best IQ but are large and heavy, µ4/3 has really good IQ and is smaller and lighter, an all in one camera (like you are switching to) has good to poor IQ but is really small and light. You have to decide what compromises you are willing to make and go from there. Personally, I have chosen µ4/3 for the small size and good IQ because I will cover 6-10+ miles in a day of photography and I don't feel like carrying around a 400mm or 600mm lens to get the reach I need.
     
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  8. ijm5012

    ijm5012 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Oct 2, 2013
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Ian
    You don't have to justify your position. You simply have to use what you view is the best tool for the job for the type of activity and shooting you do, and in your case you're fine using a 1" sensor camera.

    I sold my Panasonic 12-35 f/2.8 and picked up a Sony RX100M4 and Olympus 12-60 SWD. I don't mind the larger size of the 12-60 on my E-M1's, and the little Sony RX100 is just a fascinating camera. The results from Sony's latest 1" sensor are very, very impressive.

    Take a look at the Sony RX10 M3. Being able to consolidate down to a single camera/lens that can go from 24mm out to 600mm, while also doing macro make it a very versatile camera, and lightening the load when hiking is always welcome.
     
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  9. Gorlash

    Gorlash Mu-43 Rookie

    24
    Aug 7, 2013
    Fremont, CA
    Okay, thanks for *all* of your advices, even the critical ones! I apologize for the tone and approach of my OP, I see now that it was likely to be taken badly. Although I haven't posted often, I've been a regular reader of these forums for all the years that I've been a member, and will likely remain an active reader even if I do move on to other formats. I *am* feeling guilty about moving away from four-thirds, especially after all the rave comments I was making when I first got my kit (mostly on Flickr and social networks, rather than on four-thirds forums, where they would have been rather superfluous)... but you're right, I need to choose what's right for me and move on, without necessarily talking about it on forums.

    ITM, your comments have given me several other alternatives to look at in single-camera solutions, and I thank you *very* much for those!!
     
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  10. tkbslc

    tkbslc Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Don't be a jerk, dude. Did you even read his post?
     
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  11. kwalsh

    kwalsh Mu-43 Top Veteran

    775
    Mar 3, 2012
    Baltimore, MD
    Not sure who nominated Phocal to be the forum police, nor do I see anything in your OP that justifies his rude response. You can safely ignore his belligerence, everyone else here is sane and friendly. Or maybe he just posted before his morning coffee - happens to all of us sometimes ;)

    Hiking kits are tricky for sure. Like everyone else I'd second taking a look at the RX10M3 as a way to condense your kit even further. Really the 1" sensors are really close in performance to m43 and if you are already going for superzooms on m43 then you are already trading a bit of IQ for convenience. Might as well go all the way with a single camera. And as you point out smaller sensor fixed lens cameras have a big convenience advantage when it comes to doing occasional macro work.

    Before m43 came out I spent a bit over a year trying out a LX3 and FZ28 along side my usual Canon APS-C + L-glass kit. The size difference was of course dramatic and what was nice was the LX3 had a very good quality UWA converter for it. So the two together provided a very wide range in a very small size. The FZ28 sensor was tiny and not nearly as nice as the LX3. The long end of the FZ28 zoom wasn't great contrast wise and combined with the noisy sensor made PP difficult. That setup was vastly easier to use when traveling though and so I came back with far more usable photos. If I was doing dedicated landscape photography in the golden and blue hours then of course APS-C was a better fit and worth the size and fuss. But I did do one trip with a lot of landscape and the LX3 was pretty darn impressive all the same. The 1" sensors are much less of a compromise than what I dealt with on the LX3/FZ28, not surprised you are enjoying your FZ1000.

    Personally I've gone with E-M5II, 7-14/4, 12-40/2.8, 35-100/2.8, 75-300 as my "quality" landscape shooting kit. For hikes I used the GM1, 12-32, 35-100/4-5.6 and stitch if I need wider than 12. I've got a very slow and deliberate style to taking photographs so lens changes don't bother me. But if I was traveling with other people and doing photography all day in a city then I'd seriously consider an all-in-one.
     
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  12. ApGfoo

    ApGfoo Mu-43 Regular

    158
    Dec 10, 2012
    Bay Area
    those 1inch sensor super zoom cameras look to be a great all around camera and would most benefit your style of shooting. If I didn't care about shallow DOF as much, I don't think I do so anyway, I'd probably go a similar route but go with something like the versatile lx100 since I don't need crazy amount of zoom. side note: good to see another person from Fremont here!
     
  13. Phocal

    Phocal Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Jan 3, 2014
    Yes, I read his post and looked at all of his 4 other post before I commented. He wants a one lens one camera solution for everything from macro to super telephoto that is small enough he can carry it with him always. If he had several hundred post on the forums I would have responded differently, but making your 5th post in a 3 year period to say I am done with µ4/3 is more like saying F-you to the system and forum. FYI, they have an ignore feature on the forum so if you don't like what I have to say I suggest you use that feature.

    Nope had lots of coffee already. OP makes 5th post after 3 years saying they are done with µ4/3, what kind of response did they expect? If they really wanted advice or a discussion about their issues with the system a different subject line and asking for said help would have resulted in a very different response. I just get sick of all these I am done with µ4/3 because it is not what I want from a camera system post. 99% of the time it is just a F-you as they go out the door because they feel the need to for some unknown reason to me. If someone who posted a lot and asked a lot of questions started this thread I would have also responded differently.

    BUT SERIOUSLY, AFTER 3 YEARS AND ONLY HAVING 4 PRIOR POST...........JUST GO AWAY AND DON'T BOTHER ANNOUNCING IT.
     
  14. Ian.

    Ian. Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 13, 2013
    Munich
    Ian
    Well put. Silly people posting about cameras with a "different sized" sensor, mistakenly believing that we are photography enthusiasts, and not stuck on one sensor format only. And don't ever want to hear about someone's happy success story and cool gear talk. And not realising that we are all "post count" snobs. Thinking that their opinion is just as valid, even though they have posted only a paltry number of posts.

    Let us sneer at their foolishness and display our attitude for all to see.
     
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  15. kwalsh

    kwalsh Mu-43 Top Veteran

    775
    Mar 3, 2012
    Baltimore, MD
    Well alright then, Phocal just confirms he has an obnoxious tone and unable to take the gentlemanly way out. I'll see if I can find him a forum police badge to pin on his shirt. Shiny plastic tends to make my four year old behave better, maybe it will work on Phocal?

    As to the OP you can just apply the ignore feature to Phocal as he recommends.
     
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  16. ijm5012

    ijm5012 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Oct 2, 2013
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Ian
    Another benefit of the RX10M3 is the lens speed. The 14-140 II is an f/3.5-5.6 lens, and the 100-300 is an f/4-5.6. The lens on the RX10M3 is an f/2.8-4, so on the wide end it's 2/3 a stop faster, and on the long end it's a full stop faster. This should basically off-set the slightly worse noise performance of the RX10M3.

    Seriously, it is THE perfect camera for what you're doing, as it replaces every bit of gear you current have, but sheds a ton of space and weight. IMO it's a no-brainer.
     
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  17. tkbslc

    tkbslc Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    I think your behavior is a massive "F-you" to the forum. You probably just turned away 50 noobs by making this seem like hostile forum.
     
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  18. tkbslc

    tkbslc Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    It's actually f2.4-4, so it's a full stop on both ends.
     
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  19. tkbslc

    tkbslc Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Most of us saw it as such. Try ignore Captain Crabbypants Jr.
     
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  20. Phocal

    Phocal Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Jan 3, 2014
    good
     
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