Where is this forum heading?

Discussion in 'Open Discussion' started by Al., Jun 26, 2013.

  1. Al.

    Al. Mu-43 Veteran

    Jul 3, 2010
    Hull, East Yorkshire, UK
    Real Name:
    I am risking the wrath of the moderators here, but her goes...

    This forum seems to be getting obsessed with gear and pointless topics...Will a black or silver EM5 take better pictures?.....My EM5 was abducted by aliens...
    Isn't photography about the final image instead of bickering on about wether panny is better than Oly or vice versa

    My last 3 image threads I have started, which included about 20 images have not generated one reply, are my images c**p? , some might think so, but thats not the point. I am not after praise and pats on the back, no, what I am trying to do is showcase :43: photography, to show how our minority camera system can compete on level terms with mainstream Canikon. But nobody seems bothered about pictures on here unless there pixel peeping or who's got the best image stabalization.

    I have been taking photographs for 50 years, 30 of them with darkroom work, and never before, well pre digital, did all this gear talk come into it, you picked your system, bought what lenses you could afford and got on with taking pictures.

    Maybe its time to move on

    I think this was touched on earlier this week and the thread mysteriously disapeared
  2. nstelemark

    nstelemark Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 28, 2013
    Halifax, Nova Scotia Canada
    Real Name:

    Heh - you forgot the endless discussions on film, paper and darkroom technique. Most of us could not afford any of the array of lenses that we can now. This tends to generate more debate.
  3. htc

    htc Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Jan 11, 2011
    Real Name:
    And now the debate is possible. Wasn't before the digital era. The gadget mania is a hobby too, sort of :biggrin:
  4. TetonTom

    TetonTom Mu-43 Regular

    Hi Al,

    Don't worry, it's not just this :43 photography forum. Cars, camping equipment, audio and tv; they all have their forums that are abscesses with the buying and owning, but really have every little to do with the craft itself...
  5. slappy

    slappy Mu-43 Regular

    Jan 14, 2013
    Guildford, Surrey, UK
    I'm a newbie to M43, so generally post in the long running picture threads like "dogs", "birds" etc. I don't think anyone has ever commented on my snaps, but I do get a few likes.

    Also posting one at a time means people can like (or not) one picture, but several pictures in one post perhaps puts people off 'liking' if it implies liking all of them.

    The one poster threads which seem popular are very much of a theme, for instance the ruined mental hospital, the steel works, the San Diego University architecture, the zombies, macro bugs etc.

    Perhaps say a bit more about your pictures, why you like them, how you came across the scene, will encourage discussion.
  6. sLorenzi

    sLorenzi Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Sep 15, 2010
    Real Name:
    One problem I do see in gear related discussions, is that, it's often out of reality. Frequently we can see people talking about something, say, a specific lens, as it was crap, and then we can see wonderful photos took with the very same lens. The problem is that people often loose perspective when debating gear IMO.
  7. Kenny

    Kenny Mu-43 Regular

    Sep 9, 2012
    KL Malaysia
    In my opinion, it's a good thing we have varieties of discussions here. Imagine if everything is picture, without a single word. It will be boring. Regarding the not-so-important topics, dont bother to click it you're not interested. For me, this is more than just a forum. Heck, I spend more time here instead of facebook (yes I do love youtube and vimeo). This forum is like an encyclopedia+social media+shop for m43 system to me.
  8. DeeJayK

    DeeJayK Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Feb 8, 2011
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Real Name:
    The forum is headed where we (as users) steer it. Yes, there is a lot of gear talk, but if you don't enjoy that you can always avoid those threads or sub-forums.

    As far as the lack of feedback on your recent posts, I'm not sure what your expectation is. You say you're not seeking praise, so what is it that you'd like to receive? While I believe I viewed most of these posts, I didn't post a comment. In some cases this may be just because I didn't have the time to do so at that moment, in others it may be that the images didn't compel me to. In general it has been my experience that a post containing "random" photos is less likely to generate response. It might be better to target your posts with fewer images and/or images of one particular type/subject.

    I've enjoyed many of the images you've shared (e.g. those in this thread), but for me, taking the time to provide a thorough and thoughtful image critique takes some investment of my time. I have done so on occasion, but generally only when critique is specifically requested in the thread and/or title. I have seen feathers ruffled by unsolicited criticism.

    If it is criticism that you are seeking, there was a recent thread on the topic that I would point you towards. There are a number of ideas discussed in that thread as to how one might solicit critique. One way that comes to mind is to provide critique of other's images.
  9. Lawrence A.

    Lawrence A. Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 14, 2012
    New Mexico
    Real Name:
    I've started a few picture threads that didn't take off, but those posted in threads with lots of traffic do sometimes get comments and frequently thanks. The more general the thread is, the more it is likely to be inviting to contributions by others and to gain traction. There really are a lot of people here the majority or whose posts are of pictures.

    But I don't think the obsession with gear is something new. I got a subscription to a photo magazine about 40 years ago (forget which one) that I did not renew because all it did was review and try to sell gear, and because I was an Olympus user, and even then the Canikon mafia had a stranglehold on things. Of course one could buy Aperture, View Camera, and other high end photo periodicals, but the bulk of the literature and the talk was by gear-heads.

    I worked in professional custom photo labs for over 25 years, and all the literature addressed to the lab was about processors and new and better lab equipment. The owner and the manager of a new, about to open lab I ended up working for argued bitterly about which enlarging lenses to equip the place with, Rodenstock or Schneider. To my delight, the manager prevailed, and we printers ended up using Schneider Componon S lenses, though I personally own a couple of Rodenstock -- an 80mm and a 250mm.

    Printers could be passionate about the enlargers and lenses they preferred. I was. I preferred either Omega or Durst and just never liked the way Beseler did things. And I always preferred Schneider optics. I have a 150mm Schneider Componon S that a sold and missed so severely, that I tracked it down several years latter and bought it back-- a brilliant sample of the optic, with the flattest projected field of any enlarger lens I've ever used. Talk about edge sharpness wide open!
  10. DHart

    DHart Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Jan 7, 2010
    Scottsdale, Arizona
    Real Name:
    Another reason there is so much gear talk is because cameras these days are so feature-laden and sophisticated, and they are replaced almost as quickly as we can buy them, with new models.

    In the old days, a photographer could buy a couple of good mechanical bodies, a set of lenses, and be set for decades of creating images.

    Nowadays, its almost a full time job just learning all the features of each new model that comes out, every six months. In addition, m4/3 has been a rapidly growing system over the last few years with continual releases of new lenses. It's not a mature, slow moving system... but the opposite. All of this inspires a lot of discussion!

    And let's face it, lots of people are as much or more gear oriented as they are oriented toward creating better images. For many, fussing with the gear is satisfying in and of itself.
  11. madogvelkor

    madogvelkor Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Feb 22, 2013

    Well, one reason might be that we have a variety of people of different skill levels and needs discussing things. A pro wedding photographer might have very different standards for what makes a good lens than someone who is a hobbyist, or a nature photographer, or a street photographer.
  12. Al.

    Al. Mu-43 Veteran

    Jul 3, 2010
    Hull, East Yorkshire, UK
    Real Name:
    No, not after praise, but critism and feedback would be welcome, it does take time to process, resize, upload pictures to the forum, more so for me as computers don't come natural.

    I prefer to let the pictures do the talking, thats why I am a photographer and not an author
  13. Ian.

    Ian. Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 13, 2013
    Real Name:
    OP> obsessed with gear and pointless topics..
    I like gear as well as photography. I'm not obsessed. It's fun and part of my hobby. Leave us to it!

    OP> pointless topics..
    Yes. If they are a bit of fun I'll join in with some. Sorry.

    OP> My last 3 image threads images have not generated one reply,
    I'll go there to look and enjoy. Must I reply? Do you know how many just go to look?

    OP> to show how our minority camera system can compete on level terms with mainstream Canikon. "
    Is it not mainstream? Dunno. Does that interest you? I'm not interested. Photos and gear for me. Not politics, business, market share or other systems.

    OP>But nobody seems bothered about pictures"
    I am. There are many topics about pictures. Jumping to conclusions?

    OP>pixel peeping or who's got the best image stabalization." Both interesting subjects. Here is the right place. Interesting for some. Less for others.Much more interesting than Canikon or whatever.

    OP>I have been taking photographs for 50 years, 30 of them with darkroom work, and never before, did all this gear talk come into it,"
    Wrong! 30 years ago people at camera clubs were also interested in gear. As well as art, concepts, competitions, pro work, glamour, darkroom etc. So wrong. Maybe you were cut off from other enthusiasts?

    OP>Maybe its time to move on"
    Nope. If people like a subject, who are you to interfere?

    All seems the normal variety. Each to his/her own. Let people do what they want. Maybe you didn't intend to come across as telling us which subjects are OK and which not. And that we should all comment your pictures.
  14. caimi

    caimi Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 13, 2012
    middle US
    Real Name:
    Caimi caimiphotography.com
    I'm with you, Al. I would like to see the ratio of gear talk to photo discussion reversed but I'm not holding my breath. Meanwhile, it's a very friendly forum with some very talented photographers contributing and I hope that never changes.
  15. jambaj0e

    jambaj0e Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Aug 31, 2010
    Maybe I'm more ambitious, but I would like to see some more professional usage and examples of the micro 4/3 system, particularly in areas like fashion, commercial, portraiture, and product.

    I feel that the overall vibe of the forum is that the micro4/3 is more for candid or street photography, but not much above that. Emphasis on learning how to light, especially with strobe lighting would be a great way to get more people into really learning about photography and expanding their photographic knowledge.
  16. arg245

    arg245 Mu-43 Rookie

    Apr 25, 2012
    South Florida
    This forum is no different than most of the others out.there. and like them, this forum has separate categories to cover different tastes. There's even a category for different types of images.

    I for one enjoy the variety. I can get my gear fix, and shre and see images also.

    Sent from my LG-MS770 using Mu-43 mobile app
  17. Al.

    Al. Mu-43 Veteran

    Jul 3, 2010
    Hull, East Yorkshire, UK
    Real Name:
    Do writers compare their pencils??

    do artists compare their brushes?

    do scultors compare their chisels?

    Is photography an Art or a craft? oh no!!! no answers please:eek:
  18. Ian.

    Ian. Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 13, 2013
    Real Name:
    Artists want their freedom. Not your restrictions.

    There are many tendencies here that don't interest everyone. But we don't feel the need to tell them to "move on". As long as they keep other people happy that only strengthens this forum.
  19. stratokaster

    stratokaster Mu-43 All-Pro

    Jan 4, 2011
    Kyiv, Ukraine
    Real Name:
    Yes they do! As a former student of an art school, I can safely say that artists surely do discuss their tools and materials.
  20. dougjgreen

    dougjgreen Mu-43 All-Pro

    Jun 5, 2013
    San Diego
    Real Name:
    Doug Green
    It's because the forum is ABOUT A SPECIFIC FAMILY OF GEAR. It's not entitled a photography forum - of which plenty exist. It's chartered as a place where users of a specific type of gear get together. That's embedded in the name of the place.

    Contrast this with a place like Photocamel - which has a bunch of gear forums, but it has MORE forums about specific types of photography. That forum is about photography, with a side dish of gear discussions. This forum is about Micro 4/3 photography gear, with a side dish of the photography that people who use this gear have taken with it.