Well this just rubs me raw...

Discussion in 'Image Processing' started by TexChappy, Jul 8, 2012.

  1. TexChappy

    TexChappy Mu-43 Regular

    Jun 30, 2012
    ...that I can't decide whether Raw is right for me. Haven't ever really shot it before but thinking about it with my new OM-D. I'd have to shoot Raw + Jpeg because my wife usually puts the images on her computer too and doesn't want to me mess with raw.

    My biggest silly concern with doing that is having the duplicates of files. Anybody shoot both? How do you handle it?

    For reference I use iPhoto and Aperture 3.3.
  2. jloden

    jloden Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 15, 2012
    Hunterdon County, NJ
    Real Name:
    Personally I shoot RAW because it simply gives more original data to work with rather than throwing it away. Even if it isn't important to me now, I like knowing that someday later on as my PP skills improve, I can go back and have the best possible original source to work with.

    I used iPhoto for quite a while until getting Lightroom very recently. If you don't want to shoot in RAW + JPEG you can easily import everything to iPhoto in RAW and export as JPEG as/if needed. You can select photos or an album and export as whatever quality JPEG you want in a separate folder. Even just dragging and dropping a photo from an album to the Finder will export a JPEG version with default settings. The only downside to this technique I can think of is that you're relying on the iPhoto RAW conversion rather than the camera's in-built JPEG engine. I know a lot of people are in love with the Olympus JPEG engine results, so that may be a disadvantage for some.
  3. nueces snapper

    nueces snapper Mu-43 All-Pro

    First of all ... I discard 98 or 99% of everything I shoot. This helps with having a bunch of files on your computer. Just keep the really really good ones.

    I'm not shooting RAW at the moment because I need to get over a cheapness attack and get the latest PS. I got LightRoom and hate it. Like the RAW converter but literally despise with extreme prejudice the filing structure of LR.

    What I know I'm missing is the ultimate fine detail reproduction. This hurts as little birds is a LOT of what I shoot.

    So, if you're just shooting the kids running around the back yard, or vacation photos or travel stuff ... jpeg is enough. If you want to count every leaf on the trees in your landscape shots or see the whiskers on the bear ... you need to shoot RAW. :thumbup:
  4. sprinke

    sprinke Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 5, 2011
    Pasadena, CA
    Real Name:
    I shoot both. I like having the JPEGS because I can share them quickly, and the RAW to play around with when I have the time.
  5. michaeln

    michaeln Guest

    I used to shoot RAW + Large Fine JPEG, but I never did anything with the jpgs except delete them, and like neuces snapper I delete about 98% of what I shoot anyway. I really enjoy tweaking the RAWs to be just how I want them, and I never have any need to quickly share in-camera jpegs, so now I just shoot all RAW and don't bother with the jpegs. Makes my life easier, less clutter.
  6. TexChappy

    TexChappy Mu-43 Regular

    Jun 30, 2012
    Only problem with just shooting RAW for me is that I’d have to export them to my wife as JPEGS. Probably not the end to the world but less convenient.
  7. fin azvandi

    fin azvandi Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 12, 2011
    South Bend, IN
    I used to shoot RAW+Jpeg, but after a little while I switched to RAW only and made a default minimal preset in Aperture that I apply to my RAWs on import (mainly auto-Curves and a few small tweaks). That produces files I'm happy to export to friends and family, and still leaves me with RAW material if I want to play around with other looks. I agree with previous posters that it's good to set high standards for yourself and not spend too much time processing mediocre shots, save that effort for the really good ones.
  8. Hikari

    Hikari Mu-43 All-Pro

    Nov 26, 2010
    I only shoot RAW. Why would you not want all the data from your camera? It looks like you need your own computer.
  9. usayit

    usayit Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Download lightroom trial and see if it handles RAW+JPEG to your liking better.

    IIRC, its pretty seamless (not 100% sure as I only shoot RAW) and exporting to JPG is a no brainer process in Lightroom if you just use basic adjustments.
  10. MajorMagee

    MajorMagee Mu-43 All-Pro

    Feb 24, 2011
    Dayton, OH
    My old copy of Photoshop CS2 can't read the Olympus ORF raw files directly. They have to be converted to a similarly old format of DNG first. So it's not just duplicates, but triplicates of everything. My JPG files are typically 2.6Mb, and the ORF files are 14Mb, but the DNG files are 50Mb. Unless I'm doing something really special, I just default to JPG.
  11. Lawrence A.

    Lawrence A. Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 14, 2012
    New Mexico
    Real Name:
    I shoot raw + highest quality jpeg consistently. Sometimes I have to wait to get time to develop the raw files, in the meantime I've got something to work with if I want to email something out.

    For me developing from raw is essential if I am going to print something, but having a quick jpeg around can be handy. Storage is cheap and I've never run out an sdhc card shooting that way. If you're not sure shoot raw & jpeg; you can always delete the raw files if you change your mind. But if you don't shoot them, you won't have them to decide about.
  12. flash

    flash Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Apr 29, 2010
    1 hour from Sydney Australia.
    Real Name:
    Sounds like you're embedding the ORF file in the DNG file as well as a full sized preview. You may also have the lossless compression turned off. Check you're settings in the DNG converter.

    As for raw vs jpeg, it really depends on how you're going to use the files and how much you care. For purely digital use (screens, iPads, Facebook etc) it's unlikely you'll see any real differences except if you really screw up the exposure. On the other hand, even the most basic photo quality printer can print more information than the average jpeg holds. Plus shooting Raw is like future proofing your shots. Every edition of every raw converter improves what you can get from a raw file.

    I shoot raw plus jpeg for my personal stuff and raw only for work.

  13. Dave in Wales

    Dave in Wales Mu-43 All-Pro

    Nov 5, 2011
    West Wales
    My main reason for shooting RAW now is what can be done to the White Balance.

    It's amazing how different (correct) it can be made to look compared to AutoWB.
  14. MajorMagee

    MajorMagee Mu-43 All-Pro

    Feb 24, 2011
    Dayton, OH
    DNG Preferences are set to:
    Camera Raw 4.6 or later
    Jpeg Preview Medium
    Don't embed fast load data
    Don't use lossy compression
    Preserve Pixel Count
    Don't embed original
  15. mattia

    mattia Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 3, 2012
    The Netherlands
    I shoot RAW with medium JPG. The medium JPGs are for immediate consumption - sharing with friends, Facebook, whatever - while the RAW gives me full post-processing flexibility and is the source for prints. I simply have folders per 'event' with a JPG subfolder. Lots of duplication, but end of the day, who cares? Hard disk space is cheap.
  16. Jman

    Jman Mu-43 Veteran

    Apr 20, 2011
    Columbus, OH
    I have only shot RAW since about 2005. More latitude with the file (MUCH more if you are doing heavy adjustment), more data in the highlight and shadow regions...

    And one other thing: As converters improve, your old files get BETTER. My files from my old Digital Rebel can now look far better than when I first shot with them 8 years ago because the RAW converters have improved...so I get better noise control, more highlight detail, etc.

    I also KEEP every RAW file except those that are obviously horribly off exposure wise or missed focus. And I've found some gems I passed over initially several years afterwards.
  17. brutto

    brutto Mu-43 Veteran

    Feb 17, 2011
    As you'll see if you make it thought the verbiage below (sorry), duplicates of files doesn't need to be a problem, Aperture is great tool for handling raw + jpeg pairs.

    1. When I first started using raw, I found it handy to shoot raw + jpeg. I'd import both, look at the jpeg and work on the raw until the image looked better to me than the jpeg. I found that in almost every case I could tease a more satisfying image out of the raw than the jpeg would give me. But... the jpegs were mostly very good and I can certainly see that some people wouldn't want to do the raw development work.

    2. Sometimes, usually after an exposure or white balance disaster, I thank goodness that I shoot raw. Disasters are much more recoverable in raw than jpeg.

    3. Aperture handles raw + jpeg very well. You can opt to import either or both. You can make either or both "Masters". You can view and work on both of them or either of them.

    4. An option would be to import the raws into Aperture and the jpegs into iPhoto. This would be an extra step in your workflow but may suit you.

    5. Because disk space is so cheap now I decided that the peace-of-mind I get from knowing I have back-up copies of everything is worth more than a few £££s on a big external drive. So what I do is copy the card via a card reader to a place on my external drive where I keep all the images from my E-P3. I then import the raws to Aperture (could do this from the hard drive or card - I do it from the card) and get to work. In your case, it would be easy enough for your wife to pick the jpegs up from the hard drive whenever she wanted to. Btw, my Aperture library, along with all the other important stuff, is backed up by Time Machine to another hard drive and to the "cloud" via Crashplan. You can't be too careful.
  18. Ray Sachs

    Ray Sachs Super Moderator

    Apr 17, 2010
    Near Philadephila
    If you're using two different computers, exporting them from raw (after even just the default processing) to jpeg might be the easiest way to get her the files. Import them to your computer as raws, leave them alone or tweak to taste, then batch export jpegs onto a thumb drive or something and then she can easily use them on her machine. If you shoot raw + jpeg, you're each gonna have to import separately onto your machines - you being careful to import only the raw files and her being careful to import only the jpegs. Potentially more confusing than just taking the first pass at em yourself and then just handing her a thumb drive full of jpegs. Unless she's in a real hurry, in which case it might take a few minutes longer for her to get the shots that way.

  19. m43dex

    m43dex Mu-43 Veteran

    Mar 5, 2011
    When I had the Nikon d200, I use to shot raw. But since going oly I shot raW less and less. Oly jpegs honestly are really pretty sweet, so unless it's something special.... I am a Jpeg-er.
  20. Uwharrie

    Uwharrie Mu-43 Veteran

    May 10, 2012
    North Carolina
    Real Name:
    Lynne Ezzell
    I shoot raw and use a program called ACDSee. It does a great job processes and filing. And it has a wicked fast batch process feature.
    I then will go back in Photoshop and process the raw images I really like.