Video is the reason M43 bodies will be around for a while longer......

D7k1

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Panasonic develops the Gh series for a specific video segment - and that segment is not fulfilled by its FF cameras. There are people who seriously use the Gh series of camera specifically because of the size of the M43 eco system, specifically the size and quality of the lenses.

It is my belief that the RD of producing a camera like the G9 based on the Gh cameras is significantly less costly than producing a single purpose camera (and the technology falls downware, even the Gx85 with the Cinelike D & V hack is a good video camera if you have an external recorder). I think Video is, has been, and always will be the primary market for Panasonic. The 18 Meg 6K files from the G9 are really very good, imagine even 8K files I think will becoming in the next generation if they can manage the heat.

Even if Panasonic only had the GX, G, Gh line we would have spectacular M43 bodies to use if OMD/P cameras are no longer made. Panasonic has a full line of lens (consumer and PRO) for M43. I think some thing like a $850 price point with two kit lenses for the GXxx line, $1200 to $1300 for the G line (remember it is both a stills and video camera with HighRes (perhaps with HHHR in the next vesion), and then $1800-2000 for the full blown GhX camera (Pro level video, 6K RAW files perhaps next camera).

If you have an investment in M43 line lenses I see no other rational choice if you image with video/stills. Black Magic's 6K pocket camera is $1800 but it uses Canon FF lenses.

Panasonic has to have a Gh camera as it is the entry level professional level video camera, and the stills ability fits the need for various types of videographers and give it a competitive advantage over the BM 6K pocket. Panasonic FF is in a whole another price point for it's video version.

I am going to pickup a 35-100mm f2.8 (already have the f4-5.6 and it is a killer lens for the Gx85) and a Pany Wide in the next 6 months or so. Even if only the Gh6 is the only M43 camera from Pany that would be my body choice, although I'd certainly buy either a GX or G type camera if it was available.

Here is an interesting article on Nikon by a financial analyst:

His Take for my point:

"The company has also realized that video is the future and is making significant strides in the capabilities of its cameras to record high-quality footage. This is especially appealing to video bloggers and videographers. Nikon was one the first companies to enable its full-frame mirrorless cameras to record 4K raw footage externally...",
 
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DanS

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even 8K files I think will becoming in the next generation if they can manage the heat.

THis is the only thing i don't agree with, and not because of heat concerns. I think it will take a few more years before your average consumer/enthusiast/one man band, will have enough processing power and/or storage capacity to do meaningful work with 8k footage. 8k h.264/5 & Rawish footage requires some serious processing grunt if you want a decent editing experience in your NLE. You can transcode to an intermediate codec, but then you need a lot of fast storage.
 

D7k1

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From what I've seen on the VegasPRO forum most are using proxies because even 16 core machines are "slow" with even 6K.
THis is the only thing i don't agree with, and not because of heat concerns. I think it will take a few more years before your average consumer/enthusiast/one man band, will have enough processing power and/or storage capacity to do meaningful work with 8k footage. 8k h.264/5 & Rawish footage requires some serious processing grunt if you want a decent editing experience in your NLE. You can transcode to an intermediate codec, but then you need a lot of fast storage.

So yes I do agree, but how many TV shows are broadcast (even cable) in 4K and yet the market demands it? I just think you will see it if the technology can work just to the perceptions in the market place. Like Matthew Quigley , "I said _ I didn't like it not that I can't use it" :biggrin: when it comes to 8K video.
 
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Panasonic develops the Gh series for a specific video segment - and that segment is not fulfilled by its FF cameras. There are people who seriously use the Gh series of camera specifically because of the size of the M43 eco system, specifically the size and quality of the lenses.

It is my belief that the RD of producing a camera like the G9 based on the Gh cameras is significantly less costly than producing a single purpose camera (and the technology falls downware, even the Gx85 with the Cinelike D & V hack is a good video camera if you have an external recorder). I think Video is, has been, and always will be the primary market for Panasonic. The 18 Meg 6K files from the G9 are really very good, imagine even 8K files I think will becoming in the next generation if they can manage the heat.

Even if Panasonic only had the GX, G, Gh line we would have spectacular M43 bodies to use if OMD/P cameras are no longer made. Panasonic has a full line of lens (consumer and PRO) for M43. I think some thing like a $850 price point with two kit lenses for the GXxx line, $1200 to $1300 for the G line (remember it is both a stills and video camera with HighRes (perhaps with HHHR in the next vesion), and then $1800-2000 for the full blown GhX camera (Pro level video, 6K RAW files perhaps next camera).

If you have an investment in M43 line lenses I see no other rational choice if you image with video/stills. Black Magic's 6K pocket camera is $1800 but it uses Canon FF lenses.

Panasonic has to have a Gh camera as it is the entry level professional level video camera, and the stills ability fits the need for various types of videographers and give it a competitive advantage over the BM 6K pocket. Panasonic FF is in a whole another price point for it's video version.

I am going to pickup a 35-100mm f2.8 (already have the f4-5.6 and it is a killer lens for the Gx85) and a Pany Wide in the next 6 months or so. Even if only the Gh6 is the only M43 camera from Pany that would be my body choice, although I'd certainly buy either a GX or G type camera if it was available.

Here is an interesting article on Nikon by a financial analyst:

His Take for my point:

"The company has also realized that video is the future and is making significant strides in the capabilities of its cameras to record high-quality footage. This is especially appealing to video bloggers and videographers. Nikon was one the first companies to enable its full-frame mirrorless cameras to record 4K raw footage externally...",

The BlackMagic 6K uses a Super 35 sensor and EF mount lenses.
The BlackMagic 4K uses m43 sensor and mount.
Both use a Dual Native ISO adapted sensor (400/3200), and both require passive cooling.
It's about $700 more for the larger sensor.
They are an example of how larger sensors with higher IQ command higher prices.
This also explains why Panasonic went into FF. It's extremely difficult to just specialize in a single format and hit multiple price points.

https://www.sharegrid.com/blog/posts/a-filmmakers-guide-to-sensor-sizes-and-lens-formats

https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/ca/products/blackmagicpocketcinemacamera
 

DanS

Mu-43 All-Pro
Joined
Mar 8, 2016
Messages
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The BlackMagic 6K uses a Super 35 sensor and EF mount lenses.
The BlackMagic 4K uses m43 sensor and mount.
Both use a Dual Native ISO adapted sensor (400/3200), and both require passive cooling.
It's about $700 more for the larger sensor.
They are an example of how larger sensors with higher IQ command higher prices.
This also explains why Panasonic went into FF. It's extremely difficult to just specialize in a single format and hit multiple price points.

https://www.sharegrid.com/blog/posts/a-filmmakers-guide-to-sensor-sizes-and-lens-formats

https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/ca/products/blackmagicpocketcinemacamera

I own BM products, and I'm active in the BM community, And while several of their cameras might not be that much more expensive, a lot of owners aren't exactly overly thrilled with them.
 

DanS

Mu-43 All-Pro
Joined
Mar 8, 2016
Messages
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From what I've seen on the VegasPRO forum most are using proxies because even 16 core machines are "slow" with even 6K.


So yes I do agree, but how many TV shows are broadcast (even cable) in 4K and yet the market demands it?

DaVinci Resolve does okay with it, but that's because it offloads most of the encoding and decoding to the GPU. A lot of dedicated DR machines will actually have more money tied up in the GPUs (Yes more than one) than they do in the CPU.

Honestly, I see 4K getting much more adoption in the online streaming spaces and YouTube etc than I do from traditional outlets.
 
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