Tony Northrup's new bogus video "Micro Four-Thirds is DEAD"

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Telonson

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His argument can be applied to every crop sensor camera line expect probably Fuji
You make a fair point.
yet has no problem recommending CaNikon FF DSLR cameras, which are most definitely on the way out once the mirrorless mounts are fully developed
That's going to be a much slower path. EF has been around for over 30 years, F mount for nearly 60 years. Those systems will not die easily or quickly, no matter what their makers do.

From most accounts, the legacy adapters for the new Canon and Nikon mirrorless work exceptionally well with the lenses they support. Suspect that EF lenses will continue to be used and made long after Canon has stopped making EF cameras.
 

Sato

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I frequent another site that is predominantly dslr based. You wouldn’t believe how many of them are selling their heavy FF systems and switching to m4/3. Weight is a big issue, and m4/3 is the perfect size. Not to mention price.
Thing about forums and YouTube + comments is, They don't give a true representation of reality.
Those who are happy with what they have aren't fighting a dayly battle trying to defend to death what they own online or try to justify purchasing a different system than the one they own and suffer from insecurities about their potential choice, They are using what they have and enjoying themselves.

This whole m43 is death video is a case of Tony trying to fix a '''mistake" that he made last month, Which got him into trouble with his regular viewers:
 

ijm5012

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Anyway, I'm not even agreeing with or defending Tony. I just hate reading pages of ad hominem attacks rather than actual rebuttals.
To be honest, I don't disagree with Tony. In fact, I've said the same thing: I believe that Panasonic will not "abandon" m43. They will release a new camera body and lens every now and then, but the majority of their efforts, and thus announcements & releases, will be for the L mount.

M43 is very mature and saturated, and it's tough to continue to grow in that type of market. So Panasonic decided to venture off in to a new, untapped (for them) market. From a business sense, it makes perfect sense (at least as far as "perfect sense" goes when investing in a business whose market share is continuing to shrink year after year).

Do I think Panasonic will abandon m43? No, but I believe their involvement will be seriously scaled back. So I don't think Tony is "wrong", but his use of click-baity titles conveys a slightly different message than what he's actually saying.
 

inthecage

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Do IIIIIIII think, because this is what this is all about. 'I'. Be it Tony or whoever. Do I think Panasonic will scale back M43, some perhaps, but it's a significantly different product to FF. It goes together with FF. So no, 'I' think Panasonic has every intention of releasing new cameras and lenses at an honest pace for M43 users. I don't think they are misleading M43, or slowly pulling away. By next spring we will see a few new cameras and a lens or two. If people buy them, that cycle will continue.
 

ijm5012

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By next spring we will see a few new cameras and a lens or two.
Really? So you think in ~6 months time, there will be new Panasonic cameras and lenses for the m43 system on the market?

What lenses? The only lens they showed at Photokina was the 10-25, but that was nothing more than a 3D-printed mock-up. That lens is FAR from being production ready and released. And there have been no rumors or announcements for other lenses.

What cameras? The GH5, G9, and GX9 are all pretty new cameras (the later two less than a year old). Maybe a G90 with a 20Mp sensor? But again, no announcements of developments at Photokina, and no rumors yet either.

I'd be very surprised if we see "a few cameras and a lens or two" from Panasonic for the m43 system in the next 6 months. Their primary focus is on getting the S1/S1R and associated lenses to the market to compete with Canon/Sony/Nikon.
 

danelkins

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I have watched the photo industry go through many changes over the past 20+ years and cuurently there are as many companies producing new gear than in the past. M43 biggest risk is in the physical size getting too large. These guys started the mirrorless sector and can maintain if continued wisely, and no Youtuber can take them down
 

Lindsay D

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Maybe Tony is trying to get more clicks - more money. In the photo industry social media sector, what you say (fact or fiction) can make you $$$ and he might be looking to expand his bank account.
Absolutely. Tony is an effective businessman. I daresay he'll post a follow up as well.
 

Lindsay D

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I have watched the photo industry go through many changes over the past 20+ years and cuurently there are as many companies producing new gear than in the past. M43 biggest risk is in the physical size getting too large. These guys started the mirrorless sector and can maintain if continued wisely, and no Youtuber can take them down
The key benefit of micro 4/3 is the small size and low weight of the lenses, even the professional versions when compared to full frame counterparts and in most cases APS-C.

Until full frame manufacturers are able to downscale fast lenses in a similar way (and I find that unlikely) the micro 4/3 market will continue to thrive.
 

Wisertime

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Maybe Tony is trying to get more clicks - more money. In the photo industry social media sector, what you say (fact or fiction) can make you $$$ and he might be looking to expand his bank account.
Perfectly said. Basically the same question you should ask yourself anytime you read/click anything on the internet, including the "News". :friends:
 

bikerhiker

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Tony wasn't the first that showed concern about the viability of m43. Thom Hogan did a written piece as well, though not on video that he showed concern current flagship m43 cameras like the G9 and the E-M1II had strayed away from their original ethos. That is to make m43 a pocketable camera and now they make them as large as a mirrorless FF camera.

Most consumers who are buying a camera want only 2 set of lenses. The 28-70mm (35mm eqv) and 55(70)-200mm (35mm eqv). These 2 sets are sold as kits with the T6i or T7i. They are slower lenses, but that's what most consumers simply want. So if you package them with a full frame mirrorless camera like a Sony A7 for instance, both the camera body and lens size aren't much bigger nor smaller than the E-M1II with a Olympus 12-40 f/2.8 and the Panasonic 35-100 f/2.8. While these lenses are 2 stops faster than a consumer version of the 28-70 and 55-200 for the FF mirrorless, full frame sensors are 2 stops better than the best m43. So in hindsight, it's equal. The consumer will always choose the best and it shows in sales and reality. Because the consumer can then opt to upgrade to a 2 stops or even 3 stops better professional lens(like the Canon 28-70 f/2 R). There is no 12-40 f/0.95 autofocus lens for m43. None, unless you Speedboost it with the Speedbooster. And if you speedboost it with a Sigma 18-35 f/1.8 (which happens to be Tony's favourite lens), then you wind up with the same size factor as a full frame setup with a fast or faster Pro grade 28-70mm zoom.

And this is what I paraphrased from Tony's video. To me, it seemed like people are shooting the messenger and not understanding his message.

As it has clearly shown with Canon's latest sales numbers. Their higher end sales are not in anyway affected, but their lower end to mid end products are. People are now wired to buy uber expensive cameras as long as they get the very best. This is the new market reality and which is why, I'm not surprised Olympus will introduce an uber expensive E-M1X to just maintain market share.

While m43 still maintain the size advantage, it's no longer the case if the consumer isn't using a 600mm full frame lens. Most consumers basically shoot with a medium range zoom anyhow, because what I'm seeing and hearing here is that, there is a lot of assumption put on consumers buying those 600mm lenses in droves. That is just not the case, but people always put a 300mm f/4 Olympus and pit it against the 600mm FF lens and say, that's how Olympus survive.
 
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Lindsay D

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It's certainly true that those photographers who are able to enjoy their hobby or perform their job using small lightweight (mostly) prime lenses will have the broadest equipment choices. And there won't be much of an advantage for them in switching to Micro 4/3. I know that myself because I also own Sony full frame and Sony APSC - populated only with the smaller lighter lenses. For that reason, for me, these larger sensor cameras cannot be a 'complete solution'.

As David has just alluded, micro 4/3 provides immense magnification in a very lightweight package for those who need long focal lengths without the strain. Those photographers are not going to go away in a hurry, and so far no manufacturer can compete with that. It's a significant part of the market.

Many years ago I was one of the first full-time professional photographers to adopt micro 4/3 equipment, and I was roasted for it. I've lost count of the number of times I've been told that micro 4/3 is not viable and will never gain traction. But it is widely accepted now and in fact it is a lifeline to those who cannot physically manage the weight associated with a larger format.

What I think will happen will be the development of other lines whilst micro 4/3 continues as always. When I shoot APSC alongside my GX8 the IQ from the GX8 is as good if not better in some cases (better than Canon, but not as good as Sony), the lenses are mostly sharper and always lighter, the whole kitbag is lighter, the performance is astonishing. It's a no brainer if having to make that choice. Full frame has its own uses for me, like when I have to shoot for an ad campaign and I need a lot of resolution.
 

Jay_M

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The key benefit of micro 4/3 is the small size and low weight of the lenses, even the professional versions when compared to full frame counterparts and in most cases APS-C.
Until full frame manufacturers are able to downscale fast lenses in a similar way (and I find that unlikely) the micro 4/3 market will continue to thrive.
When you look at "pro" vs "pro" lenses there is definitely a difference, especially in the weight. I think that's part of what Tony is trying to do though, he's trying to make everyone think MFT "pro" lenses are equal to FF kit lenses, based solely on aperture equivalency.

Most consumers who are buying a camera want only 2 set of lenses. The 28-70mm (35mm eqv) and 55(70)-200mm (35mm eqv). These 2 sets are sold as kits with the T6i or T7i. They are slower lenses, but that's what most consumers simply want. So if you package them with a full frame mirrorless camera like a Sony A7 for instance, both the camera body and lens size aren't much bigger nor smaller than the E-M1II with a Olympus 12-40 f/2.8 and the Panasonic 35-100 f/2.8.
While not the lenses you are mentioning, it is surprising (to me) how compact FF mirrorless can be with "kit quality" lenses compared to MFT with "pro" glass

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