Tips to Avoid Getting Scammed in Our Buy & Sell Forum

Discussion in 'Member Buy, Sell & Trade' started by santiclaws, Jul 20, 2012.

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  1. santiclaws

    santiclaws Mu-43 Regular

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    Don't get a false sense of security if you're not using the "gift" option. The "protection" offered by PayPal on sales transactions is largely an illusion. By the time you have figured out that you've been scammed and PayPal freezes the account, the scammer will have already emptied it. PayPal will do nothing else for you. Your best protection against scammers is using your brain.
     
  2. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

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    PayPal Buyer Protection isn't perfect, but it isn't worthless either. The scammer who just now tried to scam one of our members tried to get him to use Gift. The buyer insisted on regular PayPal, and when the scammer tried to walk away with the funds, the buyer filed a dispute and PayPal got him his refund. The scammer actually had the audacity to come back today and amongst a bunch of spam post this:

    7606850110_aafffb8135_o.

    If the member in question had paid by PayPal Gift, he would have had absolutely no recourse.

    If anyone wants to know more about what PayPal Buyer Protection does and does not do, read this carefully: https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=xpt/Marketing/popup/UAeBay-outside
     
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  3. Uwharrie

    Uwharrie Mu-43 Veteran

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    Lynne Ezzell
    Wow, that is a ballsy scammer! ( now that particular post makes sense though)
     
  4. WT21

    WT21 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

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    I got a refund from paypal when I did everything by the book and was scammed.

    I also check the paypal verify page. Put in this URL
    Code:
    https://www.paypal.com/us/verified/pal=PAYPALID
    where PAYPALID = the paypal e-mail address that you would send funds to.
     
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  5. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

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    Good one, Bill. Added to the list.
     
  6. qwiksilver96

    qwiksilver96 New to Mu-43

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    Frank
    That last sentence is good advice.

    I recommend that buyers use CC for payment and NOT bank transfer for transactions where there may be any question of the possibility of funny business. If you use a CC, you may have the protection of chargeback working for you if need be.

    Yes, the transaction fees are higher, but I would rather pay a small amount per transaction than risk getting burned. PayPal knows this, thus the reason they push so hard for the use of instant transfer, which I only use for small transactions.

    Additionally, for larger transactions, I often request to speak via phone with the seller and I offer up my number and a chat if I am the seller. That way at least there is some chance of traceability in case of fraud. A phone conversation can also go a long way in giving peace of mind. I cannot imagine that many scammers would want to get that up close and personal.

    There are no guarantees in life, but if you do as santiclaws suggest and use your brain, and might I suggest, go with your gut, you should do well to stave off being scammed. There is no one thing you can do to protect yourself each and every time, but with a combination of common sense, gut feeling, good practices and following the rules, you should be OK for the most part. By following these practices and principles, I've never been a victim of fraud.

    Frank
     
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  7. Luke

    Luke Mu-43 Hall of Famer

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    Luke
    I wonder if there is enough info between the scammer's Paypal transaction and some of the posts here to involve or interest the police.
     
  8. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

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    If they return to try another scam, we will report everything we have to IC3 (FBI).
     
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  9. Luke

    Luke Mu-43 Hall of Famer

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    Luke
    It just sucks that as a part of this great website, you curate a classifieds section for members to buy, sell and trade and have all the disclaimers, but still when something like this happens it just sucks up all of your free time. Even though everyone knows it is "buyer beware", Amin still takes time out of his busy schedule to help out the forum members.
     
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  10. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

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    Thanks, Luke. Kevin and Nic have also been spending a lot of their time to help with this.
     
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  11. pxpaulx

    pxpaulx Mu-43 All-Pro

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    Paul
    Another great sticky for the buy & sell - all great info, I didn't know you could do that paypal verify thing with the email! As I'm sure many of us peruse the for sale section, it is always good to remember that overall this forum is a great place to trade and acquire new gear, just to be mindful of doing while going about this part of a great hobby on the internet!
     
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  12. pancake

    pancake Mu-43 Regular

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    I had a lens that was Sent to a buyer recorded delivery, delivered but not signed
    For. Buyer tried to get refund from me.... As it "had not arived" ....Until I noticed it and the very distinctive filters
    I sent with it on a local free ads site! Yup I answered said ad and it was from same address! He didn't get his refund.
     
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  13. santiclaws

    santiclaws Mu-43 Regular

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    Was the money still in the scammer's account? PayPal's policy was always that you got your money back if they recovered it. If they didn't manage to pull it out of the scammer's account, you were out of luck. Did that change?

    Actually, Priority Mail automatically comes with delivery confirmation whether or not you buy insurance. USPS doesn't provide detailed tracking info like UPS or FedEx on their Priority Mail items, although I think they do if you use Express Mail. Priority Mail is really a very good deal. When shipping across the country, it gets there faster than UPS or FedEx ground, plus you get Saturday delivery.
     
  14. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

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    Thanks for the correction. I'll fix that part of the post.

    True not detailed, but it will give some tracking info - enough that buyers are generally happy to receive it.
     
  15. WT21

    WT21 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

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    You have to play by their rules, which are narrow, but details are here: https://cms.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/?.../UserAgreement_full#13. Protection for Buyers.

    This is paypal's reimbursement amount statement:
    13.4 Coverage Amount. If you are eligible for PayPal Purchase Protection and PayPal finds in your favor on your Claim, PayPal will reimburse you for the full purchase price of the item and original shipping costs – with no cap on coverage.

    PayPal will not reimburse you for the return shipping costs that you incur to return a Significantly Not As Described item to the Seller or other party specified by PayPal. If the Seller presents evidence that they delivered the goods to your address, PayPal may find in favor of the Seller for an Item Not Received claim even if you did not receive the goods.

    from https://cms.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/?.../UserAgreement_full#13. Protection for Buyers.
     
  16. WT21

    WT21 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

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    Do you have a source on that?
     
  17. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

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    Our recent scammer did the phone thing. Maybe he's reckless, or maybe he took extra precautions with that. Either way, he did a lot of things to seem legit - registered early, posted a bunch, hung around, had some superficially decent looking Ebay feedback, spoke on the phone, etc etc.
     
  18. santiclaws

    santiclaws Mu-43 Regular

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    Just years of people on various forums bitching that they got scammed and PayPal would not do anything. I guess they changed their policy to be in line with ebay's, which itself changed its buyer protection policy not too long ago. I had no idea this was the case, the 3% they charge is now a much better value.
     
  19. WT21

    WT21 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

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    I don't know either way, tbh, but a scammer hit a number of folks on POTN all at once. I was one of them. He was using a verified paypal account, had feedback, and had been on the board for a number of months. I did everything by the book (pp regular, etc.) and he went silent on everyone very quickly. I documented everything, took screen shots of the POTN postings, emailed it all to pp, and they covered me for $550. I was pleased, but more cautious.
     
  20. dennisk

    dennisk Mu-43 Regular

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    Dennis
    Thank you Amin for all your work to make this a safer forum.
     
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