Swirly and soapy bokeh legacy lenses

L0n3Gr3yW0lf

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It's been a few years since a thread on this has been made or updated. What I am hoping to make\get is a thread for legacy glass that makes either swirly or soapy bokeh as these are some effects that you don't normally get out of modern glass be it native or third party.
There are threads that can show this on different lenses but they are spread out and unless you have a clue what you are looking for it's either difficult or time-consuming to gather this information ... So this is what I hope this thread will be, please provide wherever possible own samples (or from the interwebs) and try to be specific on the model name and if possible year (general information is not particularly helpful, like "any C-Mount or CCTV lens"):

The lenses that make SOAPY\BUBBLY bokeh:
*Fuji Photo Film Co. Fujinon 55mm f 2.2 - M42 Mount
(Specs: FL: 55mm, F Nr. 1:2.2, 4 Elements in 4 Groups, 5 Aperture Blades, 43° Diagonal AoV, Auto Aperture, Minimum: F 16, MDF: 0.6 Meters/ 2 Feet, 155 grams, 6.2 cm ∅, 4.5 cm length, 49mm Filter Thread, Round screw-in hood, Made in Japan, Plastic Construction)
Lens:
http://allphotolenses.com/lenses/item/c_1495.html

Samples:
http://allphotolenses.com/gallery/lens/c_1495.html

The lenses that make SWIRLY bokeh are:
*Helios 44-2 58mm f 2 - M42 Mount
(Specs: FL: 58mm, F Nr. 1:2, 6 Elements in 4 Groups, 8 Aperture Blades, 40.8° Diagonal AoV, Auto Aperture, Minimum: F 16, MDF: 0.5 Meters/ 1.6 Feet, 230 (280, some information is conflicting) grams, ? cm ∅, 5.7 cm length, 49mm Filter Thread, Round screw-in hood, Made in USSR, Metal Construction, Production from 1950s to 1990s)
Lens:
http://allphotolenses.com/lenses/item/c_455.html

Samples:
http://allphotolenses.com/gallery/lens/c_455.html

(PS. Any contributions would be greatly appreciated)
 
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PakkyT

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Not to detract from the subject matter of the post, if the photos posted here are not your photos and you didn't actually get permission to repost them here from the photographer, photos from the internet should be linked to from here so people can go look at them and also potentially see the photographers other work. They should not be taken from those places and reuploaded here with no link back to the original or to the photographer as that is likely a violation of their copyright.
 

L0n3Gr3yW0lf

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Not to detract from the subject matter of the post, if the photos posted here are not your photos and you didn't actually get permission to repost them here from the photographer, photos from the internet should be linked to from here so people can go look at them and also potentially see the photographers other work. They should not be taken from those places and reuploaded here with no link back to the original or to the photographer as that is likely a violation of their copyright.
Ok, reasonable enough, I will replace the samples with links (usually people are suspicious of links posted in the forums so that leaves it up to other people to research the subject).
 
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I am still getting used to my Voightlander 42.5- F.95 but I know there is a lot of creative potential available.
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Aushiker

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this assumes the images actually are copyrighted
Yes, it does and hence the poster should be able to confirm otherwise.

That said the terms and rules of this site are pretty clear on the subject:

Do not post anyone else's photographic work, modified or otherwise, in any of our forums, galleries, or other site sections without the explicit permission of the copyright holder.

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If you post someone else's copyrighted photographic work in the forums, please specify the nature of your use (used with permission of copyright holder, used under creative commons license, etc) and be sure attribute the work properly. Attached/embedded images thought to violate copyright will be deleted.

Copyright is a complicated subject, and laws differ in different countries. We realize that a case could be made for fair use in some specific situations which are beyond the scope of what is discussed here. However, this is a privately owned and maintained site, and the above rules are our rules which apply site-wide in addition to any applicable laws.
 

L0n3Gr3yW0lf

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In my search for swirly and soapy bokeh lenses I can say that Pentax 110 lenses could do it but it's quite difficult and limiting and I would not recommend them for getting the results compare to other options:
*Same subject but at different minimum focus distance, I have tried to keep the perspective as similar as possible:
W0LF6720-Edit.JPG
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Pentax 110 18mm f 2.8, can be quite soapy bokeh balls but it works mostly at minimum focus distance, of 25 cm, it's my favourite lens of the entire set.

W0LF6725-Edit.JPG
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Pentax 110 24mm f 2.8, it looks a bit less soapy but because it's longer focal length with 35 cm minimum focus distance it could be easier to get bigger balls.

W0LF6726-Edit.JPG
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Pentax 110 50mm f 2.8, interestingly and unexpectedly the lens can produces swirly background bokeh but with a minimum focus distance of 90 cm it can be quite frustrating to get the right background.

W0LF6727-Edit.JPG
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Pentax 110 70mm f 1.8, now things got really strange, because of the 1.5 meters !!! Minimum focus distance the composition changes drastically, the background is a bit swirly but the bokeh balls are more soft and uniform in its diffusion. An interesting lens for sure but not what I was looking for.

In the end I don't think I can hold enough interest for these lenses, they do have distinct and interesting character each of them and they are fun to use but I just don't feel like taking them out and using them more then a few times. The minimum focus distance and the f 2.8 aperture seems to limit them for these 2 types of results I would like to get.
 

gnarlydog australia

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While swirls of so many old-school lenses work great on a Full Frame, our sensors only take the "central" portion of the view a SLR lens gives, often reducing or eliminating that wonderful effect of simple optical designs. Sample images from larger format sensors don't always translate to the same effect on Micro 4/3 :(
My experience is that lenses designed to cover smaller formats (16mm cine, C-mount) work better for the swirly effects.
Here one from a C-mount Cosmicar 50mm f1.4

29106374896_e1efc3d3da_h.jpg
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Lucia on Cosmi_c by gnarlydog, on Flickr


Cine projection lens Bell&Howell (16mm format) 2" f1.6

26225539532_9804c8bdd4_h.jpg
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Coy duck_c by gnarlydog, on Flickr


Bubbles on the other hand are best achieved by lenses with fewer elements, with the most success given by a triplet where the rims of the bubble are lighter giving a true soap-bubble look
Trioplan is a famous lens for that, but often overpriced. A lot of projection lenses have also an optical design of only 3 elements, but so much cheaper. Of course some tinkering is required for refitting them to be used on our cameras.

(SLR format) Meyer Optik Trioplan 50mm f2.9

21408008505_756794f92e_h.jpg
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Leaf and bubbles_c by gnarlydog, on Flickr


(35mm format ) Projection lens Will-Wetzlar Maginon 85mm f2.8

32653037516_f2b1f9118b_h.jpg
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Leaf's bubble bath_c by gnarlydog, on Flickr
 

L0n3Gr3yW0lf

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While swirls of so many old-school lenses work great on a Full Frame, our sensors only take the "central" portion of the view a SLR lens gives, often reducing or eliminating that wonderful effect of simple optical designs. Sample images from larger format sensors don't always translate to the same effect on Micro 4/3 :(
My experience is that lenses designed to cover smaller formats (16mm cine, C-mount) work better for the swirly effects.
Here one from a C-mount Cosmicar 50mm f1.4

View attachment 892018 Lucia on Cosmi_c by gnarlydog, on Flickr


Cine projection lens Bell&Howell (16mm format) 2" f1.6

View attachment 892019 Coy duck_c by gnarlydog, on Flickr


Bubbles on the other hand are best achieved by lenses with fewer elements, with the most success given by a triplet where the rims of the bubble are lighter giving a true soap-bubble look
Trioplan is a famous lens for that, but often overpriced. A lot of projection lenses have also an optical design of only 3 elements, but so much cheaper. Of course some tinkering is required for refitting them to be used on our cameras.

(SLR format) Meyer Optik Trioplan 50mm f2.9

View attachment 892020 Leaf and bubbles_c by gnarlydog, on Flickr


(35mm format ) Projection lens Will-Wetzlar Maginon 85mm f2.8

View attachment 892021 Leaf's bubble bath_c by gnarlydog, on Flickr
Thank you, this is the information I was looking for ... may I quote your samples on the first post? I will add the lens information for each.
 

L0n3Gr3yW0lf

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sure, I think you can embed those images in the post with the BBCode off my Flickr
I'm a bit weary now about posting other people stuff, with or without permission. Quotes feels more safe because it's within the community and it's just moving information up on the page to be easier (or lazier :p ) to read.
 

cjoliprsf

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I took out the Helios-44M (58mm, f/2.0, M42 mount) today to make a few shoots in the garden. Sorry, not with the Micro 4/3 camera - this lens gives the best of itself on a full frame sensor... So used the Canon 5Dii.

This first isn't a great photo, and I slightly missed the focus the onion in the foreground, but it gives a good idea on how the bokeh behaves. In the center, we have circular balls with a bit of soap-bubble effect. And as we get away from center, the shapes flatten and orient themselves on a circle, thus giving the swirly effect.
210617_3533.jpg
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Following is my preferred of those I took today, Japanese iris with just a very slight swirl.
IrisJaponais 210617_3530.jpg
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And a Fraxinella, again with just a slight swirl.
Fraxinelle 210617_3532.jpg
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And this last in the daisy field, the swirl is very apparent.
Marguerite 210617_3539.jpg
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DeeJayK

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Here's a sample I posted previously in another thread of swirly bokeh with a Computar 75mm f/1.4 c-mount lens...
Here's another sample image. Note that the bokeh appears to be exhibiting some "swirlyness" in this one.

View attachment 216964 768>

I've also updated my [post=282836]initial post on this lens[/post] to include some photographs of the lens itself and an expanded description.

- K
 
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