Step up or Step down or both?

Discussion in 'Accessories' started by shanguli, Jul 9, 2015.

  1. shanguli

    shanguli Mu-43 Regular

    89
    Sep 16, 2014
    canada
    Hello,
    I want to get the step down/step up rings that allows me to use my 82 mm Neutral Density filter on lenses such as the followings:

    Lumix 12-35 and 35-100 (both with 58 mm Filter Thread Diameter)
    Oly 17 (46 Filter Thread Diameter)
    Oly 45 (37 Filter Thread Diameter)

    & a few Canon full fram lenses:
    24-105 mm (77 Filter Thread Diameter)
    50 mm (58 Filter Thread Diameter)
    ...
    Found this seller on ebay who sells both stepup and step down: http://bit.ly/1LUTVxf
    What is the point of having both step up and step down? Aren't they identical?
    Thanks very much!
     
  2. c0ldc0ne

    c0ldc0ne Mu-43 Regular

    71
    Oct 9, 2012
    Actually, they are the exact opposite of eachother. A step up ring has the smallest diameter on the lens side, and the largest diameter on the filter side. For a step down ring, it's the other way around.

    To prevent vignetting, it's best to buy a large diameter filter and always use step up rings for your smaller diameter lenses.
     
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  3. shanguli

    shanguli Mu-43 Regular

    89
    Sep 16, 2014
    canada
    Thank you,
    Since I am getting the largest diameter ND filter, is it safe to assume that I won't really need (correct me if I am wrong, please) the step up ring? Hence the ebay link isn't the suitable choice?
     
  4. Bif

    Bif Mu-43 Veteran

    380
    May 28, 2012
    San Angelo TX
    Bruce Foreman
    You will need the STEP UP ring. Remember you are trying to "step up" from your lens filter thread to that 82mm ND filter.

    Consider ordering from B&H or amazon. That set pictured in your ebay link is too low priced and is likely of very low quality. You want decent rings that thread on and off smoothly.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. tkbslc

    tkbslc Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    You are going to find a 82mm filter unwieldy on those smaller primes and barely usable even on the 58mm zooms. It will be good on the 24-105, but I'd probably get a second 58mm filter to share for the rest of the lenses.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. shanguli

    shanguli Mu-43 Regular

    89
    Sep 16, 2014
    canada
    Thanks very much for pointing this out! I'll be careful about it, from now on...
     
  7. shanguli

    shanguli Mu-43 Regular

    89
    Sep 16, 2014
    canada
    Thanks a lot for your thoughts, but watched and read quite a few videos and articles, but I've almost never heard of this before (i.e. "82mm filter [being] unwieldy on those smaller primes and barely usable even on the 58mm zooms.").
    Could you elaborate a bit and tell me, if you know this to be the case for a fact & if so, why do you think this is (did this ever occur to you ...)?
     
  8. twokatmew

    twokatmew Mu-43 All-Pro

    Jun 1, 2012
    Lansing, MI, US
    Margaret
    It will be h-u-g-e on your 37 and 46mm lenses, like a giant saucer.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. tkbslc

    tkbslc Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    just an assumption based on the relative sizes of the objects. Imagine a nearly 4" diameter circle resting on the end of a tiny prime lens. You'll have over an inch of overhang on all sides. Hold the filter in front of those smaller lenses and see how you think it will handle. I'd be surprised if you can manual focus the 17 or 45 with that filter blocking it.

    On the 58mm zoom lenses, it won't be as bad, but it will still leave no chance of a hood, it will snag on everything, and it will make the camera difficult to set down or even carry.

    Going up or down 10-15mm is no biggie. But 50% or 100% + is not a great idea unless you are using a tripod only.
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2015
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  10. shanguli

    shanguli Mu-43 Regular

    89
    Sep 16, 2014
    canada
    I don't care about the look of it, if that's what you're referring to as the problem, as long as it doesn't affect the picture quality...
     
  11. shanguli

    shanguli Mu-43 Regular

    89
    Sep 16, 2014
    canada
    Hmmm, thanks tkbslc, but I don't want to speculate.... Can someone with the actual knowledge about this confirm the validity of the issue which tkbslc has brought up here & if I should be concerned about using 82 mm size ND filter on all my lenses (with different filter thread diameter). I say this, since all I've heard up until now (from a number of photogs, using ND filters), that you should look at your lens with the largest filter thread diameter, and go with the largest size ND filter and then use step up ring for the rest...
     
  12. piggsy

    piggsy Mu-43 All-Pro

    I think the assumption that goes into that is that you might, at most, have threads to cover between 49mm - 62mm, or 55mm - 77mm or something similar.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. budeny

    budeny Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 4, 2014
    Boulder, CO
    It depends.. if you're using ND's for motion effects, then it doesn't matter much - they will be on tripod anyway. I'm living with 105mm filters.
    But if you use them to enable wide open apertures on daylight, then yes, having 82mm filter on tiny lenses like Olympus 45mm or 17mm will be cumbersome to handle around.
    Did you consider system filters? Like Cokin P, Lee Seven5?
     
  14. Klorenzo

    Klorenzo Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 10, 2014
    Lorenzo
    Just put the 45mm on the camera and place the 82 filter in front of it (being careful not to press it too much on the lens to avoid scratches). Or you can cut a disk of paper and fix it to the lens cap. That is what it feels like. Unless you can find a 37->82 step up you will probably need to use a few stacked, like this:

    http://fcdn.photographyreview.com/a...filter-step-up-down-rings-step-up-rings-3.jpg

    I do not know which camera you have, but the E-PL5 height is 64mm, the E-M10 is 82mm, this means that the filter is going to extend below the body. Not a problem using an ND on a tripod, just a nuisance for storing the camera.

    It is correct to buy the biggest filter (to save money) but there are also usability concerns and they usually assume you use only one camera system. Anyway you can try with the 82, if you end up using the ND filter a lot and you do not like how it feels you can add a 58mm later for the micro four thirds lenses only.
    And I would expect that you will not have the need to use the ND filter on ALL of those lenses, it depends on what you are trying to get (long exposures, shoot wide open, etc.) and if the ND is variable or not.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  15. Bif

    Bif Mu-43 Veteran

    380
    May 28, 2012
    San Angelo TX
    Bruce Foreman
    With some mft lenses you should be careful concerning weight and "leverage" on the lens front if snagged on anything. I hadn't said anything but the 82mm filter is somewhat huge to be using on small lenses. Here's what I've done:

    37-52 step up rings for the lenses with 37mm filter threads. 46 to 52mm step up rings for the 14mm, 20mm, 25mm Pan/Leica. Most of the rest of my lenses have 52mm threads so 52mm filters work on most of my lenses without undue risk to the lenses.

    I do have a couple of lenses that have 58mm filter threads so I have one 1.2ND (4 stop reduction) for those few and that covers me well. For ND on the others I have .6ND (2 stops), .9ND (3 stops), and 1.2ND (4 stops), and a Polaroid variable ND all in 52mm.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2015
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  16. tkbslc

    tkbslc Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Well I guess I wasted my time trying to save you frustration with my non-actual knowledge. My apologies.

    Just for fun, you may try cutting an 82mm disc out of cardboard and holding it to the front of your lenses to see if I could be right.
     
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  17. shanguli

    shanguli Mu-43 Regular

    89
    Sep 16, 2014
    canada
    I have the GH3, but don't know what the height of it is. But the height of the GH3 is not my primary concern, and as you've pointed out I'd either station it on a tripod or something, if I am going for long exposure. I like to shoot architecture/landscape, but mostly do portraits/headshots and was thinking of using the Variable ND filter to cut out the light/reduce exposure, while using wide aperture in bright day light....).


    This is the Variable ND filter I am thinking of getting:
    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/searc...&N=0&InitialSearch=yes&sts=ma&Top+Nav-Search=
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2015
  18. gr6825

    gr6825 Mu-43 Veteran

    277
    Oct 10, 2012
    If your largest filter ring is 77mm, why would you get the 82mm?? You can just get 77mm for use on the 24-105mm and then get "step-down" rings for your smaller lenses. Even with a 77mm (as others have pointed out above) that thing is going to be very much overkill on your small M43 lenses. If you want to just have one filter, I guess this is the only way.
     
  19. Sammyboy

    Sammyboy m43 Pro

    Oct 26, 2010
    Steeler Country
    .... if you don't want take advise, why don't you subscribe to the "school of hard knocks", learn first hand, buy the step-up ring to use your 82mm filter on your lens with 37mm filter threads. Then you can report back and tell us your thoughts on that set-up ......
     
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  20. shanguli

    shanguli Mu-43 Regular

    89
    Sep 16, 2014
    canada
    I often borrow the Canon 24-70mm, which has the 82 Filter Thread Diameter.