Sony A7R4

Joined
Oct 24, 2012
Messages
374
Location
Melbourne, OZ
Real Name
Adam
It depends on what you want to do. There are times when I prefer to use my Pen F or even the little D-Lux rather than my 42 Mp FF. I certainly don't feel the need for 61 Mp, or 240 Mp using the pixel shift. For what I use my Pen for, the AF is entirely fine - I can't think of a time when I've missed a shot because of its AF inadequacies, although I know I've missed shots because of my own inadequacies.

It's not that I wouldn't appreciate some improvements in a never-to-happen Pen F2, but I already appreciate the advantages that the Pen F has over my FF system in some aspects; advantages that may be lost in trying to emulate the bigger system.
 

SteveAdler

Mu-43 Top Veteran
Joined
May 12, 2019
Messages
527
It depends on what you want to do. There are times when I prefer to use my Pen F or even the little D-Lux rather than my 42 Mp FF. I certainly don't feel the need for 61 Mp, or 240 Mp using the pixel shift. For what I use my Pen for, the AF is entirely fine - I can't think of a time when I've missed a shot because of its AF inadequacies, although I know I've missed shots because of my own inadequacies.

It's not that I wouldn't appreciate some improvements in a never-to-happen Pen F2, but I already appreciate the advantages that the Pen F has over my FF system in some aspects; advantages that may be lost in trying to emulate the bigger system.
With 61mp one can always use smaller image sizes. But its hard to use pixel shift on moving people and animals.
 

Turbofrog

Mu-43 Legend
Joined
Mar 21, 2014
Messages
5,362
Dear Olympus,
20MP M43 cameras won't cut it anymore when Sony is delivering 61MP FF cameras.

It's time to up your game.

We need more 30MP+

Far better C-AF accuracy and speed

More dynamic range

Waiting for your answer.

Sony A7rIV officially announced! - sonyalpharumors
Isn't that sort of like saying that just because you can buy a 600 hp BMW M5 that 200 hp won't cut it for your little commuter car?

Good enough is good enough. More isn't always more...
 

Acraftman

Mu-43 Top Veteran
Joined
Jan 7, 2017
Messages
641
Somebody had listed a AR7iii for maybe $800 here on CL and I was very interested until someone pointed out it was 99% probability of a scam , but prior to that I did a little research and read a number of people pointing out the downsides of having to deal with such large files ALL the time which made a lot of sense, even with the em1mkii I haven't seen that many people claiming the upgrade from 16 to 20 mp has been a game changer,I have had the mk5ii for three years and still am not sure if the em1mkii will make a big difference in my shooting. I wish it would handle noise a little better (the 5mkii).
 

Will Focus

Mu-43 Hall of Famer
Joined
Nov 28, 2017
Messages
2,055
Location
Traverse City, Michigan USA
Dear Olympus,
20MP M43 cameras won't cut it anymore when Sony is delivering 61MP FF cameras.

It's time to up your game.

We need more 30MP+

Far better C-AF accuracy and speed

More dynamic range

Waiting for your answer.

Sony A7rIV officially announced! - sonyalpharumors
You may feel silly about this post when in 8 months Sony comes out with the A7rV, the 120 mp model for 2995.00 with a free extra battery and 12 month subscription to "How to Buy a Digital Camera in Today's Ever Changing Market World".
Personally, I'm waiting for the A7VII. Now that is going to be something to see!
 

mrvo

Mu-43 Rookie
Joined
Oct 15, 2018
Messages
24
I envy the cropping aspect for product photography that’s all.

Ergonomic is hard to beat my current E-M1.2 consider f1.2 lens combo. I’ve held all the recent FF mirrorless so no fan boy here. The Nikon is fairly comfortable though.
 
Last edited:

drd1135

Zen Snapshooter
Joined
Mar 17, 2011
Messages
6,185
Location
Southwest Virginia
Real Name
Steve
24 has been my sweet spot, although a 32 mp sensor is supposedly coming. If we just divide the area of the FF sensor by that of the mu43 sensor we get 3.84. If I cut a mu43 sensor out of that 61 mp sensor I get about 16 mp. Those pixels will be really small on the 32 mp sensor. We’d need some new tech to get acceptable noise at high iso. For me, high iso noise is more important than more resolution. Feel free to correct my analysis if I am wrong.
 

Turbofrog

Mu-43 Legend
Joined
Mar 21, 2014
Messages
5,362
24 has been my sweet spot, although a 32 mp sensor is supposedly coming. If we just divide the area of the FF sensor by that of the mu43 sensor we get 3.84. If I cut a mu43 sensor out of that 61 mp sensor I get about 16 mp. Those pixels will be really small on the 32 mp sensor. We’d need some new tech to get acceptable noise at high iso. For me, high iso noise is more important than more resolution. Feel free to correct my analysis if I am wrong.
32 MP M4/3 has bigger pixels than 20MP 1", for what it's worth.
 

drd1135

Zen Snapshooter
Joined
Mar 17, 2011
Messages
6,185
Location
Southwest Virginia
Real Name
Steve
32 MP M4/3 has bigger pixels than 20MP 1", for what it's worth.
Cell phones can be even smaller but they use computational methods to correct. For whatever reason, camera makers are far worse at that technology. I tend to shoot in little corners of the world so even in daytime I depend on good high iso noise. Either way, the 34 mp is coming but who knows when.
 
Last edited:

Carbonman

Mu-43 Hall of Famer
Joined
Jul 10, 2014
Messages
2,431
Location
Vancouver BC
Real Name
Graham
If I cut a mu43 sensor out of that 61 mp sensor I get about 16 mp. Those pixels will be really small on the 32 mp sensor.
Once the pixels get to a small enough size, you run into pixel vs. light wavelength effects. To combat those issues you have to use more processing power and multiple exposures to give more dynamic range. I don't have any issues with 20MP, especially since the file size is convenient for downloads and I can pull excellent 16x20 and 20x30 prints from 16 or 20MP files.
For the vast majority of photographers, needing higher pixel counts is mostly measurbating.
 

drd1135

Zen Snapshooter
Joined
Mar 17, 2011
Messages
6,185
Location
Southwest Virginia
Real Name
Steve
Hi MP is useful for some people like landscape shooters so it makes sense to have one in your lineup if you make FF bodies. However, it appears for FF and APS-C that 24 MP is a good compromise of many factors. I doubt that this new A7R IV is going to be their best selling camera. Now that I say it, I think only Samsung had a bigger APS C sensor at 28 mp (I looked it up. ) 8k video might drive the MP up, however.
 
Last edited:

drd1135

Zen Snapshooter
Joined
Mar 17, 2011
Messages
6,185
Location
Southwest Virginia
Real Name
Steve
I was really unclear in my post above. I guess I shouldn’t rant after 9 pm. :doh:

I have a Fuji XE3 which has the 24 mp sensor to which I was referring. My EM1 II obviously has 20 mp. I am happy with the resolution of both. I do like the noise levels of the Fuji at iso 6400 better than the EM1 II, although the latter has better AF. The 32 (actually 34) mp sensor to which I was referring is a “yet to be” mu43 sensor from Sony, Sony Working 34MP M4/3 Format Sensor « NEW CAMERA. Point is, that sensor isn’t here yet and Olympus can’t do much about it. They don’t make sensors. For the same reason, I suspect it might also be a while before Nikon gets a shot at that 61 mp sensor. A good discussion of problems for higher Rez mu43 sensors is in this thread:
Sony working on 34mp mu43 sensor
 
Last edited:

T N Args

Agent Photocateur
Joined
Dec 3, 2013
Messages
3,507
Location
Adelaide, Australia
Real Name
call me Arg
cant be very good..... they reused the rear screen from the mk3 and the same processor.... poor job sony
Quote
It has the same Bionz X processor and tilting 1.44M-dot touchscreen display as the Mark III.
Why did you stop the quote there? The next sentence says,
"Sony says it knew there was a 61MP sensor coming from Sony Semiconductor, so was able to design these chips in anticipation of it."
So why say "poor job Sony"?
 

drd1135

Zen Snapshooter
Joined
Mar 17, 2011
Messages
6,185
Location
Southwest Virginia
Real Name
Steve
I envy the cropping aspect for product photography that’s all.

Ergonomic is hard to beat my current E-M1.2 consider f1.2 lens combo. I’ve held all the recent FF mirrorless so no fan boy here. The Nikon is fairly comfortable though.
The Z7 and the A7 IV are about the same size as the EM1 II. But the lenses are much bigger if you want them fast or long or zoomy. Physics is a real nuisance.
 

AussiePhil

Mu-43 Hall of Famer
Joined
Jun 1, 2014
Messages
2,938
Location
Canberra, ACT, Aust
Real Name
Phil
Why did you stop the quote there? The next sentence says,
"Sony says it knew there was a 61MP sensor coming from Sony Semiconductor, so was able to design these chips in anticipation of it."
So why say "poor job Sony"?
Arg
guess I should have stuck a bunch of smilies or something ...... maybe my humour ability is at it's all time low after 10 days of illness ... "the "poor job Sony" was a big fat dig at all the :it's got to be all new" thread commentators
Hell the EM1X got absolutely chewed apart about its reuse of components yet in the 1400+ comments section of the dpr announcement for the Sony it seemed to rate no real mention they reused the old rear LCD that seemed also to be quite low spec compared to everything else.

Can't say i particular agree with the OP as well..... 61MP 35mm is not even 16MP 4/3 on a pixel size basis.....
I do think though it's time for a jump in Resolution for the EM5mk3 and the em1mk3 bodies
We don't need more 30MP+ ......... but it is highly desirable.

we already have better C-AF accuracy and speed than ever before..... improvements will be nice

More dynamic range - everyone says this and Steve may be one of the guys that can use it but i'll bet 99.99% of camera users would not notice a drop in DR
 

Linh

Mu-43 All-Pro
Joined
Apr 14, 2009
Messages
1,693
Location
Maryland, US
I'd much rather get better CAF, better dynamic range, and better high ISO (w/o sacrifice to the low end) first. Then we can start talking 30MP+ Also, I'm waiting for software to better utilize all my cores so I can process all this crap, heh.
 

Latest posts

Links on this page may be to our affiliates. Sales through affiliate links may benefit this site.
Mu-43 is a fan site and not associated with Olympus, Panasonic, or other manufacturers mentioned on this site.
Forum post reactions by Twemoji: https://github.com/twitter/twemoji
Copyright © 2009-2019 Amin Forums, LLC
Top Bottom