Sony A6500

Discussion in 'Other Systems' started by Starfleet, Oct 6, 2016.

  1. Starfleet

    Starfleet Mu-43 Veteran

    263
    Feb 14, 2015
    Michigan, USA
    Alex
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. astrostl

    astrostl Mu-43 Veteran

    360
    Oct 4, 2014
    St. Louis, MO
    Justin Honold
    They still need to kindly add some good non-FE lenses.

    I was more excited about the prospect of an RX100 M5 with a touchscreen. Would have upgraded for that!
     
  3. Hypilein

    Hypilein Mu-43 Veteran

    293
    Mar 18, 2015
    So sony released 1 (one!) lens – a superzoom – for APS-C emount in the last 2 years according to the lens list that a quick search found me. I might have missed some (hopefully), but that does not sound like a mu43s killer to me...
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  4. nstelemark

    nstelemark Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 28, 2013
    Halifax, Nova Scotia Canada
    Larry
    That is certainly compelling. But there is the issue of glass, there is very little really compelling APS-C E-mount glass. Most of the long glass is adapted Canon mount or a few fairly pricey Minolta lenses in A-mount.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. ijm5012

    ijm5012 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Oct 2, 2013
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Ian
    A $1400 without dual dials? Their "premium" standard zoom is the much maligned 16-70 f/4 Zeiss. There are no native f/2.8 zooms for APS-C. They have a few good primes (24mm Zeiss, 35mm 1.8, 20mm pancake).

    While it's a good camera, it's not a good system. Sony's full attention is on FF cameras, evident by the release schedule of cameras and APS-C lenses (seriously, when was last native APS-C lens released).

    The premier APS-C camera system is still Fuji, with their excellent cameras AND lenses.
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
  6. nstelemark

    nstelemark Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 28, 2013
    Halifax, Nova Scotia Canada
    Larry
    For some of us a crop sensor is all about having some long glass. Olympus and Panasonic are both delivering. Not to mention some of the stellar 4/3 tele lenses.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. kingduct

    kingduct Mu-43 Veteran

    300
    Oct 12, 2013
    I agree with almost everyone here: this is a compelling camera, but Sony lacks lenses for it. Kind of like the new Canon.

    That said, I think Olympus and Panasonic really need to drop their prices on their bodies: if Sony and Canon start getting more market share with their APS-C MILCs, I think they'll start making more lenses for them. And if the Sony and Canon prices are competitive with the Olympus and Panasonic prices, certainly they will get increasing market share.

    (I think Panasonic is starting to realize this, with the competitive G85 kit, but I still think the two companies need to have some good sales this Fall on their mid-tier models.)
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. nstelemark

    nstelemark Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 28, 2013
    Halifax, Nova Scotia Canada
    Larry
    this.
     
  9. tkbslc

    tkbslc Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Any excitement one feels for Sony (especially APS-C) is quickly dampened when shopping for lenses. Go ahead and plan out a lens kit to replace your m4/3 and get back to us... :)
     
  10. TNcasual

    TNcasual Mu-43 All-Pro

    Dec 2, 2014
    Knoxville, TN
    If it wasn't so pricy compared to mft, it would make a good digital back for legacy glass.

    Truth be told, if this was available when I first bought into mft, I would have probably went with the Sony. I knew I wanted to use legacy glass.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2016
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Sad Sad x 1
  11. Starfleet

    Starfleet Mu-43 Veteran

    263
    Feb 14, 2015
    Michigan, USA
    Alex
    I agree, there is not much good APS-C glass, but it does not take long to come out with good three zoom lenses - they already have some good primes. I mean, just look at Panasonic at Photokina, presenting the new 3 zoom lenses. I would be concerned if I was working for either Olympus or Panasonic. The majority of enthusiasts, for the same price, would probably pick an A6500 over an E-M1 Mark II. One less body sold, means many less lenses sold... and suddenly the m43 market shrinks more and more. Anyway, personally I do not see in the A6500 what I would want to use yet, but I do see how for many other people that camera would be more than good enough, and certainly look like a better offer compared to a high end m43 camera.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2016
  12. Hypilein

    Hypilein Mu-43 Veteran

    293
    Mar 18, 2015
    Can you please explain to me why the "majority of enthusiasts" would prefer an A6500 over the EM1 MarkII? With a single dial and no weather sealing it is not even in the same class, regardless of internal specs, which also seem to be less strong. An APS-C sensor does not make a superior camera.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  13. Turbofrog

    Turbofrog Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Mar 21, 2014
    It's a very nice camera, but still a downgrade on ergonomics from higher-end M4/3 offerings, and it is very expensive. I don't understand why they didn't use the control style of the NEX-7 for such a high-end body. They've needed to change the internal shell from the A6000 to A6300 to A6500, so it's not even like they're making big margins on amortized tooling. It's just weird.

    This camera suggests to me that M4/3 is priced about where it should be, really. This sits in between:

    1) G85 - $900. Does everything this camera does, with better ergonomics, a better EVF, better weather-sealing, and a fully-articulated screen. Downsides are worse continuous autofocus, lower burst speeds, 2/3 EV of low-light, and 22% less resolution.

    2) E-M1 II - $1600-2000. Does everything this camera does, with better ergonomics, a better EVF, better weather-sealing, and a fully-articulated screen. Continuous AF is likely comparable, burst speeds are faster, has a high-res mode, software focus limiter, dual card slots, lots of pro features. Downsides are...maybe 1/3 EV low light (maybe), and 9% less resolution.

    So the M4/3 line-up brackets this competitor in a very reasonable way. This is before lenses are taken into account. First, Sony has no weather-sealed APS-C lenses. Not even one. Second, in terms of zooms, the f2.8 M4/3 options instantly wipe-out any of the low-light advantages of APS-C E-mount cameras with f/4 zooms, and realistically, probably wipe out the resolution difference as well. In terms of primes, the f1.8 Sony primes are pretty good value, but there are only 2 (35mm and 50mm). The f2.8 pancakes are poor. There are no fast ultrawide or telephoto options unless you buy astronomically expensive and large FE lenses.

    APS-C Sony is nice as a niche camera, mostly for videography or sports and wildlife shooting with FE lenses. As an all-around option, it quickly starts to look a little bit lopsided when you consider the price they're asking.
     
  14. Starfleet

    Starfleet Mu-43 Veteran

    263
    Feb 14, 2015
    Michigan, USA
    Alex
    It does have a second dial, in the back, like some DSLRs. Not comfortable, but it is there. For the rest, most people don't need weather sealing. How many times you see people using their cameras in the rain or extreme conditions, other than actual photographers? An APS-C, with image stabilization will give you better IQ than m43 with good lenses, and especially better noise. I mean, that is why Olympus has always pushed so hard for IBS, so you could lower your ISO and get lower noise comparable to larger sensors.
    a6500.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2016
  15. Starfleet

    Starfleet Mu-43 Veteran

    263
    Feb 14, 2015
    Michigan, USA
    Alex
    That is a very optimistic value... 1/3 EV.
    The cameras are not even out yet.
     
  16. Turbofrog

    Turbofrog Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Mar 21, 2014
    Is it? Right now the A6300 has about 2/3 EV benefit compared to modern M4/3 bodies. Not a full 1 EV, that can be seen in this comparison.

    Olympus claims the E-M1 II is 1 EV better than current M4/3. I don't believe that, and I'm discounting it so significantly that I'm going to say it's only 1/3 EV better than what we have now. So that means a 1/3 EV gap between it and the A6300.

    Is there any indication that the sensor is in any way different in the A6500? If anything, IBIS may make heat dissipation more difficult with this body, which would have the impact of worsening sensor noise.
     
  17. Starfleet

    Starfleet Mu-43 Veteran

    263
    Feb 14, 2015
    Michigan, USA
    Alex
    You might be right -and yes, no indication they have changed the sensor or improved noise and DR in the A6500. We shall see when both cameras come out. Just for curiosity - I am really not a Sony fan. Prefer my Olympus cameras any day, just for the shooting experience. And I hope this is more a push for m43 to get even better.
     
  18. ijm5012

    ijm5012 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Oct 2, 2013
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Ian
    There are a couple flaws with your logic:
    • You don't know how long those PL lenses have been in development. They could have been in development for 6+ months, 12+ months, etc. Plus, they're not even out yet. One of them (the 50-200) isn't even under construction yet. So unless you know the exact amount of time it take for a lens to work through the development cycle, from inception to launch, you can't say "it doesn't take long to come out with three good zoom lenses".
    • Panasonic's lens designers can focus solely on making lenses for m43. Sony isn't in that same boat, as they have to design lenses for FF cameras as well as APS-C cameras, and it's abundantly clear where their efforts have been focused.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  19. Speedliner

    Speedliner Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 2, 2015
    Southern NJ, USA
    Rob
    And suddenly the e-m1 mkii's 15/18/60 FPS seems reasonable instead of outrageous. Things are advancing quickly in mirrorless land.
     
  20. JYPfoto

    JYPfoto Mu-43 Veteran

    268
    Aug 27, 2013
    The problem is that some dslrs have a dial in the back (like Canon for example), but their other dial is in front so you're using your index finger to control one and your thumb for the other. But with Sony both dials are controlled using your thumb, so not as quick to change.