Sell EM5 II for Sony A7 series?

Discussion in 'Other Systems' started by JDK504, Jan 26, 2016.

  1. JDK504

    JDK504 Mu-43 Top Veteran

    528
    Jun 28, 2013
    I have EM5 II with Pany 1.4 and Noc 1.2. I am thinking of selling it all for the Sony A7 series; I haven't decided which model yet and picking up the Sony 35 1.4 and the 55 1.8 or something around there. I really love the more filmic look in their pictures and video. Am I crazy thinking this? What would I be gaining in changing cameras. More importantly what would I be giving up?
    I shoot as much video as stills. I love the 5axis in the EM5 II.

    Anyone else made the switch either way? I would love to hear from you.

    Much Obliged,

    Ken
     
  2. robcee

    robcee Mu-43 Veteran

    289
    Jan 10, 2016
    Toronto
    Rob Campbell
    you'll be giving up a little speed and gaining some questionable ergonomics and weight.

    Full frame sensor though, and a stop of dynamic range and better noise control. As a video shooter, you gain access to a bunch of excellent lenses and adapters (like M mount and leica and voigtlander). Sony S-log profile as well and 4k on some of them – albeit a little funky on the A7RII.

    I've used a first gen A7R with native and adapted lenses and just didn't like it. I was always aware of the camera and it never felt natural to me. The mark II A7 seem to be improved, but still has the sony control scheme I don't like.

    I am very comfortable with my Olympus but recognize its limitations. Go with your heart (and wallet)!
     
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  3. gr6825

    gr6825 Mu-43 Veteran

    277
    Oct 10, 2012
    This may be harsh advice, but vague requests like this usually mean you don't really know what you want. If by "filmic" you mean more shallow DOF, then go for it. Sony A7 is going to give you more ways to limit DOF compared to M4/3 - even compared to those fast lenses you have. But I caution against an impulsive switch. Have you spent any time using the A7? Switching systems is inefficient ($$$) and often does not provide the "grass is greener" outcome. There are going to be trade-offs between A7 system and M4/3. It may be helpful to make a list and compare the positives and negatives to give you an overview.
     
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  4. Jonathan F/2

    Jonathan F/2 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 10, 2011
    Los Angeles, CA
    Do it! You'll never know unless you try!
     
  5. bigboysdad

    bigboysdad Mu-43 All-Pro

    Aug 25, 2013
    Sydney/ London
    Get the A7. If you don't, it'll just keep nagging at you like it is with 1 or 2 members of this forum. Hearing opinions from a mix of members from this forum won't change that itch. You won't truly be able to say you like it/ don't like it till you've tried it.
     
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  6. JDK504

    JDK504 Mu-43 Top Veteran

    528
    Jun 28, 2013
    I hear what you are saying. I wouldn't do this on a whim. I am waiting to see what the EMI II brings. I love the ergonomics of M43 cameras and maybe Olympus is going FF ;)
    I shoot a ton of stills, but I'm a video guy at heart. I contemplated the GH4 but I love the 5axis and don't want to fix everything in post. I have a strong heart beat and it gives my footage that odd little movement.

    I"m just here to learn and see what others that have made the switch or own the Sony cams have to say. If I do decide to jump ship it will only be after a long thorough research process.
     
  7. JDK504

    JDK504 Mu-43 Top Veteran

    528
    Jun 28, 2013
    That is true! Sometimes you have to make a mistake to realize it is a mistake. Or it could not be a mistake ;)
     
  8. So Thankful

    So Thankful Mu-43 Veteran

    232
    Jun 9, 2015
    Midwest
    Why not try renting some Sony equipment and give it a try. Then if it turns out you don't like it your not out any money but the cost of the rental.
     
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  9. gr6825

    gr6825 Mu-43 Veteran

    277
    Oct 10, 2012
    I am mainly a Nikon shooter and I recently picked up a Nikon D700 to compliment my D300. I like more control over DOF, and I love the D700 so far. In some photos, I can notice an obvious improvement in DR compared to my D300. In other photos, I'd be hard pressed to find noticeable differences. Overall though, I love the look of the D700 images and I am happy to be able to shoot DX and FX depending on the situation. So if you like the "look" of the Sony A7 series output then I think it is worth exploring. If you like shooting zooms, I think there will be a big and obvious difference in lens size compared to M43. If you use primes, then you can put together a very manageable A7 kit. Good luck!
     
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  10. WT21

    WT21 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Feb 19, 2010
    Boston
    OK, I did the switch, and here's my bias: I don't have a big budget, I don't do video, and I'm an amateur. I also am prone to shoot jpgs.

    I'll leave any debates about IQ, etc. aside as I think there are trade-offs more than anything.

    Bodies
    I am currently only Sony (still have a couple of m43 lenses), and here's my take -- first I can only afford the a7, which is good, but not fantastic. The a7 has a sensor reflection issue if you do night time shots, and the ergonomics are not great. The jpg engine is weak, and the RAW is lossy compressed. There is also no IBIS. ("Other than that Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?") I have it for specific reasons (and don't take night shots), but YMMV. The a7ii ergos are MUCH better, but is also 2X the cost used.

    From what I've read (haven't used one) the a7s low light is AMAZING, but, ironically, it doesn't focus in low light, and AFAIK has the same ergo issues as the a7. For $3K you can get the a7rii, which by all accounts is probably one of the top 2 or 3 bodies currently available from anyone. For me, I don't want super-high res photos, as it would force me into a computer upgrade cycle. Again, YMMV.

    Lenses
    The 35/1.4 seems to be a stellar lens, but by all accounts suffers from QC issues out of the factory, so beware buying used. Test it first. Decentering seems to be the biggest issue. The 55/1.8 is a great lens, though you pay for it.

    I like the 70-200/4 a lot, and is probably the top reason I have an a7. I also have the 28/2, which is a rare lens for Sony (that is, it's both good and affordable -- Sony doesn't have many of those. The have bad and cheap, good and expensive, and bad and expensive, lol, but not too many affordable and good). If you can afford it, the Batis lenses are supposed to be top-notch (currently offered in 85mm and 25mm). If you are into manual focus, I find the Sony focus peaking to be the best I've used, though I haven't used a newer m43 body than the GX7.I have a voigtlander 40mm/1.4 which just sings on the Sony bodies.

    There's all sorts of talk about adapting AF lenses (Sony alpha, Canon EOS, Minolta). I've reviewed these lenses thinking about trying it, but e.g. the Minolta's have a lot of legacy issues (like flare, PF) that come from old coatings (they also ugly!) The Alpha lenses are big and expensive. The Canon lenses seem to hold the most hope, and while I'm a former Canon shooter, so I know many of those lenses, I am on a budget and the adapters are the cost of a moderate lens. I also prefer to stay a bit compact if I can. Adapted EF lenses don't really help there. Also, you need one of the newer bodies to really have good AF. I am not even 100% sure the a7 base will AF at all with EOS, or at best it's C-AF.

    Advice (FWIW)
    My advice -- review and be realistic about the lenses you use and need. Sony is very frustrating in that the lens options are very thin. If you KNOW they have the lenses you want, and you can afford one of the newer bodies, it may be worth the switch. If you are unsure, then only buy a few pieces (or rent) and try it out. Give it some time. Don't sell your m43 stuff right away, and let the honeymoon phase pass first.

    btw -- one of the reasons I still have m43 lenses is because the resale value has dropped, and these lenses are not really available in Sony land, so I'm debating whether to take the hit on resale, or buy back a cheap m43 body just to use on my last lenses.

    Good luck!
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2016
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  11. JDK504

    JDK504 Mu-43 Top Veteran

    528
    Jun 28, 2013
    Thank you for your response. You made some great and valid points. I know every system has its cons and we have to decide what we can and cant live with.
    I'm in love with the M43 system for thousands of reasons. I'm looking forward to what the EM1 II holds along with what new fast lenses Olympus puts out.

    On the other hand I also really am in love with the look of the Sony A7II/FF etc. M43 gets close to that with the glass we have available.
     
  12. MAubrey

    MAubrey Photographer

    Jul 9, 2012
    Bellingham, WA
    Mike Aubrey
    Like WT21, I made the switch. Actually, I still shoot my E-M5 a bit, but I'm basically FF now.

    There is one hope for adapted EF lenses on an A7 body: the DEO Saker Falcon Lite, if you can find one, will give you good AF even on the original A7 body: DEO
     
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  13. CWRailman

    CWRailman Mu-43 Top Veteran

    564
    Jun 2, 2015
    Scottsdale, Arizona
    Denny
    Besides their lack of understanding when it comes to ergonomics which I experienced when trying several of their line at the store and has also been mentioned in several reviews, I do not like the fact that most of the lenses are large and reminiscent of what I had when shooting DSLR's. Personally, I use and go between Olympus E-M5, E-M10 and Fuji X-T1 and X-T10 but I did not feel any draw to Sony products and they do not provide anything that I need photographically. However if you think you might like it then rent one and see for yourself.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2016
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  14. ijm5012

    ijm5012 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Oct 2, 2013
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Ian
    LOL, you're the ones asking us what you'll lose/gain in making the switch? If you're thinking of making the switch, one would hope that you would have already worked that our yourself to justify the change.

    If you want video, you'll want any of the Mk.II versions, or the A7S. If you don't care about printing your stuff, and do video and just web sharing of your images, the lower resolution of the A7S/II won't be an issue, but the video performance will be a huge jump.

    If you do print stuff, and tend to print large, the A7RII may be the way to go. The still images are like using the hi-res mode of the E-M5 II all the time, without any of the drawbacks of motion. It can do 4K in camera, and can do full frame or super 35.

    If you just want a nice, basic camera that does well, the A7II is a great option. It has IBIS, more resolution than the E-M5 II, and improved video.


    There will be some sacrifices made, but that's necessary in order to realize the gains you're looking for in your images/video. If the shallow DoF and better ISO performance are what you crave, then m43 isn't the right system for you.

    Make the jump. The worst that can happen is that you lose some money in the whole ordeal and you come back to m43.
     
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  15. WT21

    WT21 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Feb 19, 2010
    Boston
    OH -- JUST THOUGHT OF ANOTHER ISSUE

    Sony sensor cleaning is not nearly as good as Oly. You will have to clean your sensor at some point.
     
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  16. JDK504

    JDK504 Mu-43 Top Veteran

    528
    Jun 28, 2013
    Is anyone that have the Sony using it for video or just mainly stills? I'm looking to hear from those that use the video as well.
     
  17. Lcrunyon

    Lcrunyon Mu-43 Top Veteran

    762
    Jun 4, 2014
    Maryland
    Loren
    Just to throw out another option to consider, but if what you want is shallower DoF, you could try faster lenses, like the Voigtlanders, the PL 42.5, or wait for the new Oly f/1.2 primes.
     
  18. JDK504

    JDK504 Mu-43 Top Veteran

    528
    Jun 28, 2013
    I have The Nocticron and have tried the Noktons. Like I said the look is close, but not quite of the Sony. I think I'm trying to justify my GAS lol

    I am eagerly awaiting to see what Olympus puts out there with the EM1 II and new glass
     
  19. CWRailman

    CWRailman Mu-43 Top Veteran

    564
    Jun 2, 2015
    Scottsdale, Arizona
    Denny
    Depending on which Sony model you have in mind the video might be better, equal or worse that an Olympus. What model are you specifically talking about?

    What "look" are you specifically referencing. What is it about that "look" that intrigues you? Normally when someone is talking about the look of an image they are talking about the colors from Fuji. I am not so sure I have heard that much acclaim for any look from a Sony but maybe I have been associating with the wrong groups.
     
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  20. ijm5012

    ijm5012 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Oct 2, 2013
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Ian
    The CSV lenses need to be stopped down a bit to get sharp, and wide open they're already the equivalent of a FF f/2 lens in terms of DoF. The Olympus lenses will likely be usable wide open, but then again they're going to give you the DoF of a f/2.4 lens on a FF sensor.

    For shallow DoF, a FF sensor is the way to go.
     
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