Robin is back!

PakkyT

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Wouldn't that mean that the other OMDS Visionaries behave in similar way? Do they?

Beats me. I don't follow any of them so I wouldn't know.


I don't like these suggestions that a person must fake it if they're positive and energetic.

More reading into my posts things I didn't say. I never implied, let alone said, Robin's comments were untrue or not genuine. Nor did anyone else. Once again, I was simply pointing out that as an ambassador to the brand he will feature a positive bias while minimizing the discussion of negatives or deficiencies in the OMD equipment.
 

fortwodriver

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What is the practical difference between being Visionary for this company vs OMDS? Does OMDS have no say who OMD World Imaging chooses as a Visionary?

"NEW BRAND CARETAKER: OMD WORLD IMAGING

You just said it yourself. OMDs may provide a kind of guide for establishing visionaries, but in this case, it's all on YL's shoulders. Of course, if Robin started doing something that actually pissed off or damaged the brand, OMDs' representatives handling the relationship with YL may step in and ask that he be removed, but this is NOT the workings of OMDs.

Also, I questioned who Robin actually met at Olympus way back. It sounded to me like he ended up being in touch with their Asian technical support engineers, not product design engineers.
 

RS86

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More reading into my posts things I didn't say. I never implied, let alone said, Robin's comments were untrue or not genuine. Nor did anyone else. Once again, I was simply pointing out that as an ambassador to the brand he will feature a positive bias while minimizing the discussion of negatives or deficiencies in the OMD equipment.

What was said, and what you agreed with, saying that's what a person does when he gets paid by a company:

stevedo: "Just comes across as way too positive and gushing at times."

PakkyT response: "Well ya, that is what the company expects when they PAY someone to talk about your products. He is an advertisement, not an independent reviewer."

"Gushing

expressing a positive feeling, especially praise, in such a strong way that it does not sound sincere:

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/gushing
 

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I agree partly on the bolded part. And I'm certainly not always in the mood to watch his videos.

But really, as he stated in some video, he just might be that way, that kind of person. Very positive and energetic. Might be a cultural thing too, who knows. Finns are certainly not usually like him. It's good to have options and diversity.
I think you are exactly right here. I think he's just that way, so I cut him a lot of slack with that in mind. He's seems very genuine, at least to me. Also, what I think about this controversy is that we all know very well that he's a Visionary (which he states up front), so when he gives a review you do know where he's coming from, so you take that into consideration. We're all adults here and not a bunch of rubes! :)

Also, I think he knows what he's talking about and explains things very well. For example, his explanation of how the two different hi-res modes work was very informative. I don't mind if he gets all enthusiastic about it; some of this stuff is pretty nifty!
 

RS86

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You just said it yourself. OMDs may provide a kind of guide for establishing visionaries, but in this case, it's all on YL's shoulders. Of course, if Robin started doing something that actually pissed off or damaged the brand, OMDs' representatives handling the relationship with YL may step in and ask that he be removed, but this is NOT the workings of OMDs.

Also, I questioned who Robin actually met at Olympus way back. It sounded to me like he ended up being in touch with their Asian technical support engineers, not product design engineers.

Did you read the article? It had this:

"Many of you may not know this, but I was sent to Japan for product training on a yearly basis. I have learned the trade secrets, understand the how the cameras and lenses work, the design and thought process of the engineers in making OM-D and Zuiko products - essentially these enabled me to be able to share my tips and tricks on Olympus products here in this blog and my YouTube channel. My level of product knowledge was unfairly higher than most people because of this exclusive training that I had access to, and believe me, I know a lot more secrets that I cannot even share here."

I'm still interested in what is the practical difference between these Visionaries for OMDS or OMD World Imaging? How does it matter to pick on this detail?
 

PakkyT

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What was said, and what you agreed with, saying that's what a person does when he gets paid by a company:

Yes, but did I say he was dishonest, lying, misinforming, other otherwise not trustworthy?

And dictionaries are not authorities on how people should use words. Their definitions are the mostly commonly used meaning of words but are by no means the only meaning and also are sometime technically incorrect. So save your dictionary quoting for English majors who might actually care what their take is on a word.
 

RS86

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Yes, but did I say he was dishonest, lying, misinforming, other otherwise not trustworthy?

And dictionaries are not authorities on how people should use words. Their definitions are the mostly commonly used meaning of words but are by no means the only meaning and also are sometime technically incorrect. So save your dictionary quoting for English majors who might actually care what their take is on a word.

This is what I said, regarding the "gushing" comment.

"I don't like these suggestions that a person must fake it if they're positive and energetic. "

So did I say you said he was dishonest etc.?

You agreed that he seems gushing, which means he doesn't sound sincere. Not being sincere means the same as faking it, no?

Also you stated that he is getting paid to be very positive and gushing, which can imply that he is lying about the products he uses, and of course that he is not naturally that way.
 

PakkyT

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You agreed that he seems gushing, which means he doesn't sound sincere. Not being sincere means the same as faking it, no?

No. As pointed out in the last comment (reread it again since you must of missed it even though it was the biggest paragraph of the short reply) you are intent on applying a specific definition to a word used by someone who may not have meant it exactly that way nor did I infer it that specific way. If I gush about my wife or kids, does that mean I am not sincere or lying? Of course not, well except in your very narrow definition of the word where in your world words can only have singular specific meanings I guess.


Also you stated that he is getting paid to be very positive and gushing, which can imply that he is lying about the products he uses, and of course that he is not naturally that way.

I know you are trying very hard to keep reading in meanings and intentions to my and other people's posts, but no one implied he is lying, just because that is what you chose to infer from our posts. With respect to what I wrote, stop telling me what I meant or might have implied when I have been very clear about exactly what I meant and corrected your misconceptions. Your continuing to keep trying to tell me I don't know what I meant after telling you exactly what I meant is making you seem obtuse and since I doubt you are an idiot I have to assume you are being deliberately so, which is childish and tiresome.
 

RS86

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No. As pointed out in the last comment (reread it again since you must of missed it even though it was the biggest paragraph of the short reply) you are intent on applying a specific definition to a word used by someone who may not have meant it exactly that way nor did I infer it that specific way. If I gush about my wife or kids, does that mean I am not sincere or lying? Of course not, well except in your very narrow definition of the word where in your world words can only have singular specific meanings I guess.

I know you are trying very hard to keep reading in meanings and intentions to my and other people's posts, but no one implied he is lying, just because that is what you chose to infer from our posts. With respect to what I wrote, stop telling me what I meant or might have implied when I have been very clear about exactly what I meant and corrected your misconceptions. Your continuing to keep trying to tell me I don't know what I meant after telling you exactly what I meant is making you seem obtuse and since I doubt you are an idiot I have to assume you are being deliberately so, which is childish and tiresome.

I suggest you be more careful with how you state things, rather than blame me for saying that I don't like what is implied by couple persons here regarding Robin.

I already corrected that he is very very likely not being paid by OMDS, like any current Visionary, unlike you said.

And I just took the first google result for "gushing", and that was the only explanation there in the Cambridge Dictionary. Also it was said that he is overly positive AND gushing, so the gushing part seemed to relate to what I googled, not being sincere.

Thank you for the clarifications.
 
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hoggdoc

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Can you provide the evidence he is getting paid by Olympus? Because every Visionary I have seen, has said that they aren't getting paid. They can get some discounts for products though.

Robin emphasized that he hasn't been paid, but does it because he wants to, in his video too.

I also know that Robin has criticized Olympus products in the past.
Actually I remember watching one of robins videos where he stated that he was under contract to Olympus and actually works for Olympus. So with that I think you can say he was paid for his opinion.
 

RS86

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Actually I remember watching one of robins videos where he stated that he was under contract to Olympus and actually works for Olympus. So with that I think you can say he was paid for his opinion.

In the link I put on earlier page, he said he worked for Olympus Malaysia between 2013-2017. PakkyT said he is getting paid to talk about their products.

He has not been an employee for Olympus for ~4 years. Visionaries might have been paid in 2012, but I'm fairly certain they are not anymore, or for many years. This is what I have heard from most of them who make videos for Youtube.
 
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PakkyT

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PakkyT said he is getting paid to talk about their products.

And as we already discussed, but you conveniently like to pretend didn't happen, I conceded that perhaps my use of "paid" was the wrong word and so to defer to your sensitivity to how words are used, I changed the word to "consideration". Robin very clearly states he was with Olympus and is again now under the Malaysian company UNDER CONTRACT. In basic contract law you can not have a contract without consideration. Consideration is the mutual agreement of some benefit given by one party in exchange for a consideration from the other party. What that "consideration" is the Robin gets, I have no idea nor do I care. But all the same, he is getting something for promoting the Olympus brand in Malaysia.
 

RS86

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And as we already discussed, but you conveniently like to pretend didn't happen, I conceded that perhaps my use of "paid" was the wrong word and so to defer to your sensitivity to how words are used, I changed the word to "consideration". Robin very clearly states he was with Olympus and is again now under the Malaysian company UNDER CONTRACT. In basic contract law you can not have a contract without consideration. Consideration is the mutual agreement of some benefit given by one party in exchange for a consideration from the other party. What that "consideration" is the Robin gets, I have no idea nor do I care. But all the same, he is getting something for promoting the Olympus brand in Malaysia.

No I didn't. If you didn't notice, I answered to hoggdoc argument on what was the basic argument.
 

RS86

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LOL - So all you're doing is speculating.

Speculating, i.e. in this instance a posh word for guessing :)

No. I'm saying what I have heard for sure Visionaries like Joe Edelman and Robin Wong for example say. They get discounts, not much else. They have paid their own equipment. The benefit is mutual, as the company gets free advertisement, and the Visionaries also get some fame from it.

Now on the other hand, I think Joe Edelman said that he gets paid by Olympus when he does workshops for them, but that is another matter. That is work that is ordered for them, not product reviews or such things. And Robin Wong doesn't do workshops for Olympus as far as I know. He did when he was an employee years ago.

Can you explain what you meant by "gushing"?
 

RS86

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LOL LOL LOL

Heard for sure from who exactly. Names please. Just looks to me as if you like making stuff up.

In answer to your question, no.

I asked a couple of them, so let's see their answer. I'm interested in the truth about things, not rumours or hints that they're faking it, especially Robin who this thread is about. Of course he might fake it, and be totally different person in real life, who knows.
 
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