Right or Wrong: Photographers Decision

Discussion in 'Open Discussion' started by digitalandfilm, Dec 5, 2012.

  1. Chronos

    Chronos Mu-43 Regular

    Oct 18, 2012
    Real Name:
    Man that is a tough one.

    All this blame is falling on the photographer instead of the guy who shoved him onto the tracks.

    According to the photographer he was too far away to reach him, he said he was shooting hoping the conductor would see the flash and stop.

    in the image, you can tell the flash WAS firing.

    at the time of the images we see that train is moving so fast there is NO chance to get there in time to help him, those trains come in very fast.

    As for releasing the photos, there is now law against it, I'm sure he sold the image and got some money for it, which in my own personal view is in pretty poor taste.

    I think it was inappropriate for the news paper to publish that on the front page.

    IN the end, nobody will ever know, i think most people are generally good people. Ill give this guy the benefit of the doubt.

    I think the newspaper editor is an ass for printing the image though.
  2. Jonathan F/2

    Jonathan F/2 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 10, 2011
    Los Angeles, CA
    The photog said it happened too fast for him to even react. Those trains come up fast. This isn't an incident that happened after the fact and he shot it. It happened right then, right there. Shame on the NY Post for actually printing these photos and sensationalizing a man's death!

    Though if the photog had the means to save him and he didn't, then shame on him and I hope his demons eat at his conscious!

    The real story was why the man was pushed into the tracks? Hate crime? Mugging?
  3. goldenlight

    goldenlight Mu-43 All-Pro

    Jan 30, 2010
    Real Name:
    It's a difficult one. I don't think I would have taken pictures, but in that type of situation do you really have time to think, rather than just react out of instinct? People are quick to condem this type of picture because it is a horror that has happened in our own safe world, but we seem able to accept news footage from war zones in other parts of the globe almost to the point of being immune to it. In either case the photographer only records what he sees. Double standards?
  4. RobWatson

    RobWatson Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Regret can be unrelenting. The part that stuck me was "At the same time, the perp was running toward me. I was afraid he might push me onto the tracks."

    Too far away to help so grab the perp (or at least photograph them) to prevent them from getting away.

    Taking an active role is the best preventative to a life of regret (not to mention the obvious tangible benefits). Doing ones best and failing (one can always work to be/do better) is always preferred to soulda/whoudla/coulda retrospectives.

    Anyway, Monday morning quaterbacking is easy.
  5. Hyubie

    Hyubie Unique like everyone else

    Oct 15, 2010
    Real Name:
    It's shooting the messenger all over again.

    Can you blame Eddie Adams for not stopping General Nguyen Ngoc Loan?
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  6. LeoS

    LeoS Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Aug 6, 2012
    Here's a brief analysis of the pictures:

    Clues that Abbasi lied about New York Post subway photo?

    Also, according to witnesses, the guy was down the track for 60-90 seconds. That sounds like plenty of time to help, but then again you may not know how dire the situation was/whether the guy could get up to the platform by himself(?) until it's too late?
  7. tanngrisnir3

    tanngrisnir3 Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Oct 18, 2011
    The poor bastard was clearly panicked.

    Looking at the shot, WHY didn't he simply run to the other side, where it appears there is ample room to dodge the train?
  8. Steven

    Steven Mu-43 All-Pro

    May 25, 2012
    In that type of situation, you also have to consider if you are physically strong enough to help. There is a possibility you just might get pulled down too.

    As for.the story- the pusher guy was caught. He is some homeless drifter guy. The story gets complicated- apparently the dead man had a fight with his wife and was drinking with bottle of vodka found n him. He may have been talking and/or arguing with the homeless guy(not a good idea generally).
  9. Hyubie

    Hyubie Unique like everyone else

    Oct 15, 2010
    Real Name:
    We don't know if cropping/straightening was done though.
  10. LeoS

    LeoS Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Aug 6, 2012
    That part of the analysis, i'm not too keen with.

    But from the series of pictures shown, it's obvious that the photographer actually moved away from the track (to the left side) and not toward the victim, because in the earlier picture you could see the bottom of the track and the photographer was probably standing close to the edge of the platform to get that angle.

    I'm not judging his actions, but the pictures do not support his claim that he was running toward the guy.
  11. clockwise

    clockwise Mu-43 Regular

    Apr 23, 2012
    New York, NY
    Real Name:
    Brian R
    If he could have helped but didn't, and nobody else was there trying to pull the poor guy off the tracks, then he deserves whatever blame people want to heap on him. The photographer wasn't making a wildlife documentary, he was a human amongst other humans, and he had an obligation to act properly regardless of whether he's carrying a camera or not.

    That said, if he was too far from the man and couldn't have done anything to help, then his actions may have been in poor taste but not morally culpable.
  12. spatulaboy

    spatulaboy I'm not really here

    Jul 13, 2011
    North Carolina
    Real Name:
    I don't see how anyone's first reaction would be to snap a picture. I would have dropped my camera and ran over there.
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  13. RobWatson

    RobWatson Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Under such stress we tend to fall back on what we have the most training. People do all kinds of inappropriate things when subjected to stress way beyond our typical experience.
  14. dgorman47

    dgorman47 Mu-43 Regular

    Mar 13, 2012
    Real Name:
    For me the issue here is less about the actions of the photographer and more about the Post's decision to print the cover. Poor choice if you ask me.
  15. Djarum

    Djarum Super Moderator

    Dec 15, 2009
    Huntsville, AL, USA
    Real Name:
    That doesn't bother me to much. If not on the post, it would have been elsewhere.
  16. Hyubie

    Hyubie Unique like everyone else

    Oct 15, 2010
    Real Name:
    Really, why is it any different from Kevin Carter's Pulitzer Prize winning image? Granted he got depressed and took his own life, but that's after the fact. The NY Post photo might not win any prizes soon, but for me the philosophy is the same.

    Attached Files:

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  17. WT21

    WT21 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Feb 19, 2010
    IMO (and nothing more than an opinion).

    The Photog should drop the BS line about how he was trying to signal the train to stop with his flash. "I couldn't do anything to help, and was afraid I could get pulled down" is more likely the case, and would have more sympathy. Or even "I saw this situation, and I reacted without thinking by taking pictures. Looking back, I did not reason at all, nor did I honestly understand the man was about to die." is another. "I was trying to stop the train with my flash" is crap.

    The editor should be fired. I've seen this compared to many war time photos and other gruesome shots. Perhaps if this was a gang war, and the picture was used to demonstrate how destructive a current situation is, and that we should be more involved in rising up to stop it -- that's one thing. This is just a sensationalist headline grab, and the editor should be canned.
  18. Kees

    Kees Mu-43 Regular

    Jun 30, 2011
    The Netherlands
    Real Name:
    Kees Dignum
    It's different because it could be argued that publishing Carter's picture could invoke actions to help remedy the situation.

    I personally think there is a rather large grey area there....
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  19. WT21

    WT21 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Feb 19, 2010
    I disagree. This image is there to draw attention to a plight of humanity that many of us ignore. The man about to die in front of the train serves no purpose but morbid curiosity. It does not inform or educate us in a positive way, and it does not challenge us to break out of a decadent mind-set, EXCEPT the decadent mindset that continues to support the Post.
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