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Discussion in 'Help and Feedback' started by Mu-43.com, Aug 5, 2012.

  1. Mu-43.com


    Aug 24, 2010
    Mu-43.com has always been a helpful, friendly place for Micro 4/3 users. We've had a long list of admins, moderators, and senior members who set this example, and the community developed accordingly.

    Being nice has literally been part of our Terms of Service since day 1.
    Lately it has occurred to us that the vibe here has been less friendly. Like any active forum, we get a lot of new members, and some have experienced other forums where aggressive or otherwise discourteous behavior is either allowed or ignored. Although everyone said "I agree" to our TOS when they joined, we know that not everyone reads it or thinks we mean it.

    We mean it. Anyone who participates here is expected to communicate with others on the board as you would if you were speaking face to face.

    If you like this site and believe that it's important for everyone to be nice, friendly, and helpful, then please help us keep this place on track. Set a good example, and avoid returning like with like when someone else is aggressive or rude. Feel free to point out when someone's comments are out of line with the expected behavior in this forum. You can do so with your own reply in a thread, but we also encourage you to report such posts by clicking on the [​IMG] icon above the post. This alerts all site moderators to the post.

    We will be sending notices of TOS infractions for posts which violate our policies. If you receive such a notice and don't agree that your post was rude and/or unfriendly, then take our notice as an indication of what we mean in the TOS. These infractions are not visible to other members - they are a private notice between the moderators and the person who receives them. We can't expect everyone to share our opinion of what is desirable, but we can set an expectation for what is acceptable on this site.

    Mu-43.com is still a nice and friendly place where members are helpful to one another. We appreciate everyone's help in keeping it that way.

    -Your Mu-43.com moderator team (Amin, Nic, and Kevin)

    PS - We regret that this message may come across as patronizing. The majority of our members didn't need this. However, after a few months of noting this change to our community tone, we decided it was necessary to say something to make a change.
    • Like Like x 74
  2. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Apr 10, 2009
    Boston, MA (USA)
    Feel free to leave your comments, suggestions, etc. If you have or have not noticed a change in forum tone, we'd like to hear about it.
    • Like Like x 3
  3. WT21

    WT21 Super Moderator Subscribing Member

    Feb 19, 2010
    Only comment is thank you
    • Like Like x 3
  4. dogs100

    dogs100 Mu-43 All-Pro Subscribing Member

    Nov 12, 2011
    N Devon UK
  5. Bokeaji

    Bokeaji Gonzo's Dad O.*

    Aug 6, 2011
    Austin, TX
    GASP! my naturally guilty conscience is going to make me reread all my posts to make sure i didnt forget any smiley faces to bring out the humor in anything i said!



    • Like Like x 1
  6. pdh

    pdh Mu-43 Top Veteran

    May 6, 2010
    I moved over to SC a good while ago but I kept an eye on mu-43 until about 6 months ago . I was finding the tone of posts becoming increasingly aggressive and decided I simply didn't want to bother reading them any more.

    I think it's important to remember that appending a smiley to a rude or aggressive post doesn't defuse the rudeness or aggressive intent ... And of course even if humour was intended, some folk won't share the sense of humour behind it ... Especially if one's own sense of humour is sharp or dry or sarcastic (I say this as someone with a sharp sarcastic dry sense of humour, by the way).

    I think It's good to have these debates about tone and behaviour within communities like this one so well done to nic amin and Kevin for initiating one.

    Now I expect I'll disappear into the woodwork again for another year ...
    • Like Like x 1
  7. MajorMagee

    MajorMagee Mu-43 All-Pro

    Feb 24, 2011
    Dayton, OH
    The difficulty with the written word is that it's not always possible to tell the sincere and helpful from the arrogant and condescending because there's no facial expression, tone of voice, and body language to go along with the words. It takes real skill to be able to write in a way that we can be certain how the other party will "hear" what we're trying to say. Being an international community brings with it all the differences in cultural norms that makes clear communication of intent an even more challenging task.

    To the moderators :th_salute:
    • Like Like x 5
  8. Pim

    Pim Mu-43 Regular

    I love the general good nature discussions on the forum, and would very much like to keep it that way..:)  I am a regular reader of DPR (not a contributor though) and am sometimes a little surprised at the attacks there against other posters or (more often) other systems... Surely to each his own, we are all just friends of photography I would say, so yes, hope to keep it friendly over here... Having said that I have not really experienced any negative posts here yet...hope to keep it that way.

    Thanks Amin, Nic and Kevin for reminding us what the forum should be about. You guys are doing a great job!
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Iansky

    Iansky Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Dec 26, 2009
    The Cotswolds, UK
    I guess this forum is like many others and certainly agree that since I joined (2009), the tone has changed and we are starting to see the proverbial "Trolls & antagonists" appearing.

    I am sure that the Superb team of moderators and long serving members will not bite but will in turn deal with these people swiftly to keep the integrity of the site.

    Thank you Amin and all the moderators as well as the long serving members for displaying patience and to all those intent on causing frustration I would say that this is a well matured Photo site where people respect each other and share openly skills, criticism should be given and received in polite form and taken as intended to allow improvement not to insult - I have personally learn't and continue to learn from criticism if done politely so lets keep the site friendly!
  10. drewbot

    drewbot Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Oct 21, 2011
    Toronto, ON
    This is always true when forums get more popular.

    Unfortunately it attracts more trolls who like to hide behind a computer screen.
  11. spatulaboy

    spatulaboy I'm not really here Subscribing Member

    Jul 13, 2011
    North Carolina
    Guys, I'm sorry for being a jerk.

    Ok seriously, I have not noticed too drastic a change in tone on the forums personally. I've encountered a rude response here and there but generally it hasn't been too bad. I know there is a influx of new members, so it might just be growing pains.

    Usually, I just avoid going into threads that are prime breeding grounds for heated debates. In most cases they are all gear related discussions. Why people get so aggressive and personal when discussing gear, I have no idea.

    Also, I've been here long enough to know certain members have very strong opinions on certain things. It's no use trying to argue to change their minds, but new members might not be aware.

    Of course we are all on here for a reason: to share our experiences and opinions with one another. So friendly debate is definitely healthy and helps this forum grow.
    I just want to say I'm very proud to have joined and contributed to this community. It is BY FAR, the friendliest online forum (photographic or otherwise) I have ever been involved in. Thank you Amin, Nic, Kevin, and all the wonderful members that make :43: such a wonderful community!
    • Like Like x 4
  12. nianys

    nianys Mu-43 Regular

    As a recent member who joined in primarily for the friendly atmosphere and good manners, I'm totally FOR the concept of enforced moderation, which is so cruelly missing at DPR, where members can become targets of flames, insult and even stalking (talking of experience, it happened to me on the m4/3 board) without anybody raising a finger (or doing it so late the victimized member has left anyway). The quality of the discussed content there has dropped dramatically for too many decent users parted and left the bullies play together...
    I did notice a few heated arguments lately, which are usually limited to specifically gear oriented thread. IMHO it's ok to feel strongly about something as long as we express it respectfully. I think the moderation team is doing an awesome job here, and thank them for it.
  13. kevinparis

    kevinparis Cantankerous Scotsman Subscribing Member

    Feb 12, 2010
    Gent, Belgium
    my humble suggestion is to ban the use of the words "IQ" and "sharpness" and any question that begins "What is the best....."

    those are the threads that bring out the cantankerous in me :) 

    Oh and "HDR".... but thats just me :) 


    • Like Like x 1
  14. usayit

    usayit Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    I joined the TPF way back when it was operated out the member's basement more than ten years ago. In the beginning, it was much like this place and it grew over time until the owner sold it to a business more interested in generating traffic. It now feels like a rough city these days very different from the small town feel at the beginning.

    The key difference now between thephotoforum and here is that Amin and company take a personal interest in the site. For that I can only give a big thumbs up! Thanks.

    As the community grows, it is inevitable to become a bit "less friendly" on the surface. Why? As someone already mentioned, this form of communication fails at conveying emotion. More importantly, it is natural for a larger community to have a wider range of opinions. To put it bluntly, the community grows from a homogeneous group of back-patters and "That'a boy/girl.. good job.. looks great... etc" to one were there is always someone or a group who does not agree. (I already experimented with this here posting an honest critique among a thread of "good job" posts.) I myself rarely turn down an opportunity for a good wholesome "debate" in real life and on the internet. I learn a lot through heated debates with friends while passing a few beers around. To outsiders, it may look like an unfriendly group.. but in the end we always laugh it off and have another round.

    The only thing I can say is that the forum shouldn't turn into a nanny forum and the debates (sometimes argument) often needs to run its course as long as they do not turn into personal attacks. This is absolutely natural. If not... it usually just festers into the high school mentality where the trouble makers get all the attention and become the "popular" crowd. (Thus the current state of the TPF)

    Thus far, I am very impressed with the way this place is being moderated. Keep up the good work.
    • Like Like x 1
  15. Lawrence A.

    Lawrence A. Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 14, 2012
    New Mexico
    As a self-centered crank who only recently joined the site, and who unintentionally began a thread on a topic not allowed, I of course immediately thought this thread was about ME. A couple of times on threads I thought were getting testy, defensive, and personal (with lots of plausible deniability provided by aggressively applied smileys), I spoke up trying to throw water on the flames, but may have just fanned them further. I did not believe those comments were rude, but others perhaps did.

    I do like the fact that for the most part this is a friendly place and discussions do not descend into the exchange of insults so common elsewhere. The moderation is just and applies the few rules and general principles fairly. I say that as someone who was caught up short starting a thread I should not have.
  16. MrDoug

    MrDoug Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Sep 5, 2011
    Boise, Idaho
    Everyone needs to have a good sense of humor :)  :rofl: "It's all good, I didn't do it and no one saw me do it!"
    • Like Like x 3
  17. crsnydertx

    crsnydertx Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Dec 31, 2010
    Houston, TX
    Brought to you by the epitome of friendliness: the incomparable MrDoug! Thanks for making us all laugh with you and at ourselves!
  18. Bhupinder2002

    Bhupinder2002 Mu-43 Hall of Famer Subscribing Member

    I fully agree with you .We are still very friendly but its like sometimes we do behave like a bunch of school kids on and off. We all cant have same likes and dislikes otherwise world will be avery boring place to live . Having said that , we can be more friendly and more polite and there is no harm in that. One more thing which I have seen is that no one appreciates pics , doesnt matter good or bad , just have look at them and offfer positive or constructive criticism . Many photo threads go un-noticed and peoppe hardly comment on them . On the contrary , if u start a thread about gear then everyone joins the party within in no time . We all love new lenses and cameras and love to discuss about them but we shouldnt forget that cameras take photos at the end of the day . So please appreciate threads with pics equally .:2thumbs:
    • Like Like x 2
  19. Bhupinder2002

    Bhupinder2002 Mu-43 Hall of Famer Subscribing Member

    Lol some of us have sense of humour and some of us have sense of Rumour .:wink::wink:
    Some people are quite friendly and some sometimes behave like a malignant tumour ..lol:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
  20. heedpantsnow

    heedpantsnow Mu-43 Veteran

    Jul 24, 2011
    Mods, thank you for all your hard work!
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