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Purple fringing with PanaLeica 25mm?

Discussion in 'Native Lenses' started by sprinke, Apr 3, 2012.

  1. sprinke

    sprinke Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 5, 2011
    Pasadena, CA
    I've been using my new (to me) PanaLeica 25mm f/1.4 lens recently.

    Once thing I've been noticing is a lot of purple fringing (chromatic aberration?) around white objects. And it's not just around the edges of the frame; it's dead in the center. Take this shot, at f/1.6 and 1/1300s and ISO 160:

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/debit72/7040361157/" title="P1150700 by debit72, on Flickr">
    Subscribe to see EXIF info for this image (if available)
    "640" height="480" alt="P1150700"></a>

    Note the position of my son's stormtrooper doll.

    Now here is a 100% crop of the doll.

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/debit72/7042248255/" title="P1150700 closeup by debit72, on Flickr">
    Subscribe to see EXIF info for this image (if available)
    "382" height="399" alt="P1150700 closeup"></a>

    Has anyone else noticed this? To my eye, it's noticeable even in the uncropped shot.

    Also, if anyone has tips about how to remove the fringing in Lightroom 4, I'd like to hear it. The dedicated chromatic aberration tools don't seem to do anything (maybe because our lenses are not part of the LR database?). I have been using the adjustment brush and desaturating purple and/or magenta around the edges, but that is a pain.
  2. duke

    duke Mu-43 Veteran

    Dec 4, 2010
    San Francisco Bay Area
    I don't know about LR, but on the Photoshop CS6 Beta there is a remove CA box that you can check so there is probably something similar in LR. Also I think there is an option to defringe edges that could help you out.
  3. sprinke

    sprinke Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 5, 2011
    Pasadena, CA
    Lightroom does have that, but the controls don't seem to have any affect on my pics.
  4. lubov

    lubov Mu-43 Veteran

    Apr 4, 2011
    I you have photoshop I can send you an action for getting rid of the purple fringe.
  5. Aegon

    Aegon Mu-43 Veteran

    Nov 3, 2011
    Portland, OR
    Why does the doll PF but the stormtroopers do not? Do you have other photos showing the purple around the doll?

    PF is usually most harsh at wide apertures. This photo appears to be stopped down (that is, not wide open). Usually, you wouldn't see PF of this type of shot.

    Also, this image appears to have a "purple doll face" rather than PF. To my eyes, the white area, as a whole, is purple, whereas PF is generally more harsh around edges.

    Is it possible that the doll is actually a bit purple?
  6. bedojo

    bedojo Mu-43 Regular

    Mar 14, 2011
    that is purple fringe, in light room 3 (4 is at my house and cant remember but should be similar)
    in the lens correction where you see chromatic aberration, (under manual)
    below it or somewhere in there should be defringe: change that to all edges and it will get rid of alot of the purple gunk
    it worked on the first image i downloaded it :p 

    and if the doll is in the same lighting as the troopers, they should all have fringed, might be the paint used in the doll is different then the paint in the troopers
  7. sprinke

    sprinke Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 5, 2011
    Pasadena, CA
    Here are a couple more 100% crops so you can see it's not just the doll.

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/debit72/6896300850/" title="P1150700 close-up 2 by debit72, on Flickr">
    Subscribe to see EXIF info for this image (if available)
    "478" height="359" alt="P1150700 close-up 2"></a>

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/debit72/7042400959/" title="P1150700 close-up 3 by debit72, on Flickr">
    Subscribe to see EXIF info for this image (if available)
    "471" height="354" alt="P1150700 close-up 3"></a>

    The shot was at f/1.6 so not fully wide-open but not very stopped down either.
  8. toshiro

    toshiro Mu-43 Regular

    Apr 3, 2012
    Take a look at the panaleica's CA chart, it is gone by f2.8: Panasonic Leica DG SUMMILUX 25 mm f/1.4 ASPH. review - Chromatic aberration - Lenstip.com

    Subscribe to see EXIF info for this image (if available)

    I usually read all the reviews of the lens I got and try to remember where the sweet spots and limitations are.

    In this case, shooting at f1.6 a daylight scene like this one where DOF separation if impossible makes no sense, if you had known that closing down to f2.8 would eliminate CA I bet you would have gone to f4 or f5.6 when you saw those contrasty uniforms :wink:

    there is a small tutorial here that might help with correction of CA in LR: http://www.blamethemonkey.com/chromatic-aberration

    In LR4 as well as in CS6 there is a new CA correction method that seems to be close to magic, haven`t tried it yet but looks promising
    • Like Like x 3
  9. Good explanation, thanks.
  10. bedojo

    bedojo Mu-43 Regular

    Mar 14, 2011
    ah didn't see that in the little one.
    honestly it isn't that bad at all, it is a very common problem with wide aperture primes. high contrasty scenes you will want to stop down a little to avoid it, but if you want shallow dof, then will have to fix in post.

    like dark buildings/ trees/ shirts people against bright backgrounds or visa versa, or black on white tends to do it :S.

    but that is pretty well handled by that lens :)  the canon 85mm f1.8 fringes like mad, (well mine did ) im talking about fringing on eye brows on an Asian skin in daylight contrasty light
  11. sprinke

    sprinke Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 5, 2011
    Pasadena, CA
    Wow toshiro, that's really useful information. Thank you.

    Guess this was a case where the P mode failed. I could definitely have stopped down and used a slower shutter speed.

    Learn something new every day!!
  12. IMO Panasonic seems to have employed two different P mode philosophies for selecting apertures. My GH1 is fairly conservative and will usually select quite modest apertures in P mode, whereas the GF1 I had would consistently select much larger apertures. My preference is for the GH1's philosophy.
  13. lubov

    lubov Mu-43 Veteran

    Apr 4, 2011
    *Note to self, must work on forum presence*
  14. foto2021

    foto2021 Mu-43 Veteran

    Nov 5, 2011
    SE England

    Unfortunately, that simply isn't true. CA drops from a relatively high 0.085% at f/1.4 to a still-high 0.048% at f/2.8. Even at f/4, it has only halved to 0.043% and it never gets any better than 0.04%.

    These figures might be acceptable for an inexpensive prime lens but not for a premium lens selling at a premium price.

    I have never understood the cult status of this lens. Too many people seem to believe that it must be a great lens because it has "L----" printed on it. And I don't mean "LUMIX".

    There are some truly great lenses in Micro Four Thirds, notably the Olympus 45mm f/1.8 and the Panasonic 20mm f/1.7 - two outstanding optics whose performance would justify paying double their asking prices.

    The 25mm f/1.4 is not in the same league. It is a good lens, not a great lens, and the price is high for a lens that is merely good.
    • Like Like x 3
  15. troll

    troll Mu-43 Veteran

    Jan 25, 2012
    That graph is for the lateral chromatic aberrations (btw 25mm is better here than 20mm) and those are not the same thing as purple fringing (which is often referred to as longitudinal chromatic aberrations). 25 has a fringing problem, it's obvious in the same review:
    Subscribe to see EXIF info for this image (if available)

    Yeah, it's pretty bad, either stop it down or fix in pp. Still a fine lens though, a lot of much more expensive fast primes have the same problem.. I wouldn't say that 25mm is hugely overpriced, not as much as 12mm anyway.
    • Like Like x 2
  16. Donsantos

    Donsantos Mu-43 Regular

    Mar 24, 2012
    That is actually really good for a fast lens.

    Look at the canon 85mm 1.8 or 50mm 1.4 or sigma 30mm 1.4 and you'll see much more longitudinal fringing. Even the leicas have it. It's the most difficult chromatic aberration to correct for in the glass and is prevalent in most fast glass
  17. toshiro

    toshiro Mu-43 Regular

    Apr 3, 2012
    for CA 0,08% seems to be the treshold, below 0,06% is imperceptible and at 0,04% practically invisible.

    And in most lenses lateral and longitudinal aberration behave in the same way, in this case if you stop down the Panaleica to f2 you won't get rid of them completely but they will be pretty imperceptible, even if you heavily tonal contrast the image.
  18. D@ne

    D@ne Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Feb 23, 2012
    I've tried use the chromatic abberation fix in LR4 and it hasn't done squat for me.
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