Order shipping delays - To Canada?

[nstelemark]

Hi,

I placed my first ever order from B&H Monday. I had delayed placing it waiting for stock on an item (Hadley Pro Sage), which was backordered. I placed the order from my iPad and I realized the affiliate links don't work from the app which is unfortunate (is there a workaround for this?). I ended up picking another item since stock never materialized.

The item was finally marked as shipped with tracking two days later, ie today. Based on my location and your posted shipping time, I was ok to get the item(s) by Friday for an event in western canada that I am flying out to Sunday. With the two day delay in the order shipping there is no way it will arrive before I leave.

As a first order experience this is disappointing to say the least.

A couple of questions -

1. Is this sort of delay typical? Ie should I add at least two days to all shipping time frames?

2. What is the cross border return policy if the item is refused ( which it likely will be).

TIA

 

[nstelemark]

From dpr:

However, they [B&H] seem to take maybe 2 days before I get a tracking number from them to the left coast which takes forever via UPS Ground, especially in this bad weather season. Sits in-house there for maybe two days before going out with them.

I guess I have my answer. 2 days of order processing on top of the shipping time. This is unfortunate.

 

[kwalsh]

I'm not sure if shipping to Canada is different, but all my B&H orders ship the same day usually even when ordering in the afternoon east coast time. Since I live on the east coast that usually means I receive my items the very next day. Most of these orders are with free expedited shipping. In fact I just placed a smallish order yesterday after lunch and tracking says it is on my local truck for delivery today - this was a order just above the $49 threshold for free shipping.

I think I've had a case or two where I ordered something too small for free shipping and chose super saver shipping which did take an extra day or two.

Last thing to realize, B&H is extremely conservative with regards to fraud. New customers, new shipping addresses, new payment methods, etc., etc. often lead to double checking on their end or phone calls verifying identity or delays waiting for payments to clear. I've experienced this once or twice over the years. I know a few people have been caught by that trying to order in a hurry before a trip only to be held up by something like this (e.g. shipping to a new address different from a billing address).

 

[nstelemark]

I'm not sure if shipping to Canada is different, but all my B&H orders ship the same day usually even when ordering in the afternoon east coast time. Since I live on the east coast that usually means I receive my items the very next day. Most of these orders are with free expedited shipping. In fact I just placed a smallish order yesterday after lunch and tracking says it is on my local truck for delivery today - this was a order just above the $49 threshold for free shipping.

I think I've had a case or two where I ordered something too small for free shipping and chose super saver shipping which did take an extra day or two.

Last thing to realize, B&H is extremely conservative with regards to fraud. New customers, new shipping addresses, new payment methods, etc., etc. often lead to double checking on their end or phone calls verifying identity or delays waiting for payments to clear. I've experienced this once or twice over the years. I know a few people have been caught by that trying to order in a hurry before a trip only to be held up by something like this (e.g. shipping to a new address different from a billing address).

I paid by my business Paypal, and used my Paypal verified shipping address, ie B&H is off the hook for that AFAICT, and already has the $$. My Paypal account is more than a decade old. It's too bad as likely the shipment will simply be turned away and will go back to B&H. The B&H quote was 2-6 days to Canada and being on the east coast and roughly a days drive to NY I figured 5 days was plenty of time. If I knew it would sit for 2 days I would not have even placed the order as there was no point.

 

[dougjgreen]

You're naive if you believe that PayPal protects the seller from fraud. PayPal protects the BUYER from fraud. Frankly, if you can't tolerate an item taking 2 days to ship internationally, you should not buy anything via mail-order, and if you really couldn't spare the 2 days, you should have paid a premium for an expedited delivery service. IMHO, the fault was yours for waiting until the last minute to order. If they said 2-6 days, and you could not wait 6 days, that's your mistake, not theirs.

Most of the time involved in U.S. to Canada shipments is spent in the logistical issues of customs documentation, and the handoff between U.S. carriers and Canadian carriers - not in actual drive time.

 

[nstelemark]

You're naive if you believe that PayPal protects the seller from fraud. PayPal protects the BUYER from fraud. Frankly, if you can't tolerate an item taking 2 days to ship internationally, you should not buy anything via mail-order, and if you really couldn't spare the 2 days, you should have paid a premium for an expedited delivery service. IMHO, the fault was yours for waiting until the last minute to order. If they said 2-6 days, and you could not wait 6 days, that's your mistake, not theirs.

Most of the time involved in U.S. to Canada shipments is spent in the logistical issues of customs documentation, and the handoff between U.S. carriers and Canadian carriers - not in actual drive time.

Actually the customs documentation is very straight forward and 100% automated. And there is no shipper hand off between the US and Canada. We do 90% of our business in the US, it is very straightforward, and it is especially easy if you have a defined arrangement like B&H does with Purolator. As to Paypal, they have the funds, this is not a question of identity verification, they either accept paypal and ship to verified addresses or they don't.

As I said, if I felt there was going to be additional delay I would not have ordered, and clearly I am not the only one that is seeing this two day delay. If they had shipped on the day that I ordered, then I would have accepted the result. That was my choice, the two day delay was not. Or let me be clearer 2days + 2-6 days was not going to work, and I have not seen this sort of delay with other US vendors. We ship same day, it is not hard.

 

[dougjgreen]

A two day delay is pretty normal. B&H told you it could take 2-6 days door to door. What don't you understand about that? If you couldn't tolerate 6 days, you shouldn't have ordered. I have bought stuff that takes 6 days from them within the U.S. - I would never expect anything into Canada to take less than their stated worst case times - even to Montreal or Toronto.

The bottom line is, you made an assumption - and it was an incorrect assumption.

 

[nstelemark]

A two day delay is pretty normal. B&H told you it could take 2-6 days door to door. What don't you understand about that? If you couldn't tolerate 6 days, you shouldn't have ordered.

Sorry you are missing the point. A two day delay is not "normal" and it clearly affects US shipments too, ie this has nothing to do with verification/customs. I was OK with the chances at 2-6 days, my risk. I was not OK with 2+2-6 days, which was pointless. This is my question to B&H is a two day order processing delay for in stock items normal? If it is then this is useful information, ie I know you need to allocate at least two weeks to any shipment, or pay the large fees to UPS, which in a lot of cases does not make shipments faster, FEDEX is much better in our area for whatever reason.

 

[nstelemark]

The bottom line is, you made an assumption - and it was an incorrect assumption.

You are 100% correct on this at least. I assumed yes naively that a big online retailer like B&H who was making a concerted effort to make cross border purchases easy would endeavour to ship items in a timely fashion. My bad...

 

[dougjgreen]

Sorry you are missing the point. A two day delay is not "normal" and it clearly affects US shipments too, ie this has nothing to do with verification/customs. I was OK with the chances at 2-6 days, my risk. I was not OK with 2+2-6 days, which was pointless. This is my question to B&H is a two day order processing delay for in stock items normal? If it is then this is useful information, ie I know you need to allocate at least two weeks to any shipment, or pay the large fees to UPS, which in a lot of cases does not make shipments faster, FEDEX is much better in our area for whatever reason.

2 days is not wildly out of the ordinary. It happens enough that it would be foolhardy to assume it won't happen when you need it not to happen, unless you pay a premium for expedited shipping. My best guess is that it happens 10-20% of the time. If ANY vendor tells me 2-6 days, I wouldn't buy the item with that method of shipping, unless I could tolerate 7 days.

 

[davidzvi]

What does the tracking information say? And I mean not on the B&H site, but the shipper's site.

I've had a delay in the update of the tracking information where an item has actually been out for delivery before tracking information has been updated. Granted I'm also on the east coast so shipping is normally next day. But the point is I've seen an item actually shipped before their site so.

Just something to check.

 

[nstelemark]

What does the tracking information say? And I mean not on the B&H site, but the shipper's site.

I've had a delay in the update of the tracking information where an item has actually been out for delivery before tracking information has been updated. Granted I'm also on the east coast so shipping is normally next day. But the point is I've seen an item actually shipped before their site so.

Just something to check.

I've seen this too and I actually wasn't much concerned until I got active tracking info which put it in NY, the city not the state this morning.

 

[henryp]

1. Is this sort of delay typical? Ie should I add at least two days to all shipping time frames?
2. What is the cross border return policy if the item is refused ( which it likely will be).

First, I am sorry you're dissatisfied with any aspect of the transaction and apologize for any inconvenience. I do not know if we will be able to add support for affiliates to our smartphone and tablet apps since affiliate support depends on the customer going from the affiliate's site to ours via the affiliate's proprietary link in a straight line without opening other browser windows or tabs.

In general we do not offer a same-day shipping guarantee and since I do not know your order details I really don't know what might have delayed your order. Feel free to send the order number to me. In general, if we get an order with standard shipping after the day's cutoff time, it won't go that day. Among the info on our site about this we do advise, "To avoid higher than normal shipping and duties charges, orders containing multiple items located in different warehouses will be consolidated in one location prior to shipping. Therefore, your order may be delayed by an extra business day." Again, i don't know the details of your order so do not know if this applies. And we say this, "International orders received before 7:00am local New York time will be shipped same day."

We also advise, "If your order is being shipped from B&H (not drop-shipped) to a US shipping address, you will get an expected delivery date for each shipping option during checkout. These dates are based on carrier shipping practices, destination and the items you order." So, while we may not promise an order placed Monday will be shipped Monday, we do offer usually reliable ETA information. IMO it's more important to know when you'll get your order than when it leaves us.

Our usual policy is we refund shipping if the reason an order is returned or refused is our error. Again, not knowing the details I cannot say one way or the other.

 

[nstelemark]

Thanks Henry,

This is helpful. The order was placed at noon Monday, and based on your info it would not ship that day, I didn't read far enough down to international orders won't ship same day (well unless placed before 7:00 AM NY time). This was my mistake.

The delivery time on the order was still

Estimated Delivery:
Purolator Ground : 2-6 Business Days Delivery

which is effectively impossible when Purolator courier only received it today.

I 100% agree that a reliable estimate is more useful than a shipping date, however if I need to add 2 days to make 4-8 vice 2-6 this would be good to know. A 4-8 day estimate would have made my order "foolhardy" as someone kindly pointed out :tongue: .

 

[Replytoken]

I am sorry to hear things did not go smoothly with your order. When I place an order by mail, there are three things that I take into account for calcualting my arrival. First, is the item in stock? Second, how long does it take for the seller to ship the item after receiving my order, and accounting for cut-off times. Finally, how long is the carrier expected to take to deliver my order. I realize that anything can gum up any of these steps, but I try to understand and ask before placing the order, especially if I am paying an additional charge for expedited shipping. I order regularily from B&H, and for the most part, things run like clockwork. I cannot account for shipping to Canada, but my experiences with cross border shipping vary from no impact (Vancouver B.C. to Seattle), to wondering where my package vacationed while I was waiting for its delivery (Ontario to Seattle). You may want to give B&H another shot on a future order. They do a pretty good job of being transparent in their operations/policies.

--Ken

 

[henryp]

Thanks Henry,

This is helpful. The order was placed at noon Monday, and based on your info it would not ship that day, I didn't read far enough down to international orders won't ship same day (well unless placed before 7:00 AM NY time). This was my mistake.

We received the order noon on 8/11. It was shipped 8/12. When you placed the order shipping options included Purolator ground, "2-6 Business Days Delivery." We estimated delivery would likely be 8/15. Under these circumstances it would be our normal practice not to refund the s&h fee originally applied to your purchase. Duty, tax and other cross-border fees should go back to you. I am sorry we may not be able to fulfill this transaction to your satisfaction.

 

[nstelemark]

Eating humble pie.... well sort of

So it looks like the package will arrive. I am more than a bit surprised. Order was placed Aug 11, and started moving on the 13th.

2014-08-15 08:31 AM On vehicle for delivery Halifax, NS
2014-08-15 05:24 AM Arrived at sort facility Halifax, NS
2014-08-14 08:38 PM Arrived at sort facility Moncton, NB
2014-08-14 08:38 PM Arrived at Transfer Terminal MONCTON, NB
2014-08-13 10:02 PM Departed sort facility Toronto Sort Ctr/ctr Tri, ON
2014-08-13 10:02 PM Shipment in Transit ONTARIO HUB
2014-08-13 09:52 PM Arrived at sort facility Toronto Sort Ctr/ctr Tri, ON
2014-08-13 09:52 PM Arrived at Transfer Terminal ONTARIO HUB
2014-08-13 09:51 PM Picked up by Purolator Toronto Sort Ctr/ctr Tri, ON
2014-08-13 09:51 PM Picked up by Purolator ONTARIO HUB
2014-08-13 01:31 AM Arrived at sort facility Metro Ny Terminal
2014-08-13 01:31 AM Arrived at Transfer Terminal METRO NY TERMINAL

The really interesting thing is that two days seems to be impossible (it would have been out for delivery on 14th in Toronto, 4 days), but 5 days to here via ground is excellent.

 

[henryp]

Eating humble pie.... well sort of
So it looks like the package will arrive. I am more than a bit surprised. Order was placed Aug 11, and started moving on the 13th.
SNIP
The really interesting thing is that two days seems to be impossible (it would have been out for delivery on 14th in Toronto, 4 days), but 5 days to here via ground is excellent.

I am very glad this has been resolved to your satisfaction. I will add one caveat about Purolator, our preferred shipper to Canada. Their service and prices are excellent. Their online package tracking rates a B- IMO.

 

[davidzvi]

I am very glad this has been resolved to your satisfaction. I will add one caveat about Purolator, our preferred shipper to Canada. Their service and prices are excellent. Their online package tracking rates a B- IMO.

Sounds like USPS. I've had a package with no tracking information in the system show up on my doorstep.