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OMD EM 1 VS OMD EM 5 MARK 2, and a few dilemmas

Discussion in 'Olympus Cameras' started by panonski, Mar 16, 2015.

  1. panonski

    panonski Mu-43 Regular

    53
    Dec 13, 2014
    Hi all,

    I had a little dilemma in upgrading my m 43 system with a decent "semipro" camera. Or should I say PRO ?
    Cause this system, already have many excellent and very good lens, and have nothing to shame of. Numbers of proffessionals which leave their full frame and came to this system are proof for that

    I've already have the PEN E P5, and till now I'm very very satisfied with the stuffs in it. It's well build and have almost every thing from older brother EM 5, and couple of things that EM 5 doesn't have, like WI FI, or built in flash.

    But, I want to take my work to serios level, and I want the MAIN camera for PRO shooting.

    I've read a dosen reviews of my PEN EP 5, before I bought it, and honestly, I was quite sure he "can do the job" in most cases which is true.

    But, I have experianced some things that I don't like, and this is struggling with AF in low light situations ( contrast AF).
    I'm not sure yet is this the matter of my kit lens on it ( 14-42 zuiko 2 ) or is it the issue of the camera?

    Right now, I have doubts between the OMD EM1, and of course OMD E5 MARK II.


    Why I'm having the doubts between this two? Obviously EM5 have no Phase Detect system, but it's a lighter, with smaller grip. ( I like smaller cameras myself ). Also have some improvements from his earlier version, such as microphone jack ( maybe I'll never use it ) and 40 MP, and improvment with AF system., with electronic shutter at 16000. wow.

    OMD EM1, was out two years ago, and I'm pretty sure this will be replaced with new model any time soon.
    Also, I heard ( read ) that Phase Detect NOT WORK IN S-AF MODE ? Is this true ?


    What would you pick ?



    oPINIONS ?
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2015
  2. VooDoo64

    VooDoo64 Mu-43 Veteran

    240
    Jul 17, 2010
    Zagreb - Croatia
    Davor Vojvoda
    Yes E-M1 was out two years ago but thay give us 2 major update in fw that is like thay give us mk2 and mk3 od E-M1 for free, in fw2.0 they put so many things that is truely like a new body ( many feature and most important af much much faster and more accurate ), in fw3.0 they give us something that always was not-so-good in Olympus - good af-tracking... So E-M1 2 years ago and E-M1 form 28.02.2015 has absolutely nothing to do with the connection to the camera, which was originally released..

    ( sorry for bad english )
     
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  3. panonski

    panonski Mu-43 Regular

    53
    Dec 13, 2014
    so, you would stay with EM 1 ? Cause I want the camera with system which will satisfied my future clients.
    I know I can do it and with the PEN E 5, but like I said, I want more PRO camera then the PEN actually is.

    Sensor is the same, and some test's in reviews I found tell the ISO capabilities is sligtly better in PEN then in OMD ( strange but mybe true )

    :)
     
  4. jeffryscott

    jeffryscott Mu-43 Top Veteran

    505
    Jul 2, 2010
    Arizona
    If the 14-42 is your only lens, I would start with adding some fast, high quality lenses first. I don't think you would experience a substantial increase in quality of your photos with either camera body.

    That said, between the E-M1 and E-M5 II, I think it comes down to ergonomics (handle both and see which feels better), whether improved video is important (Mark II) or if legacy 4/3- glass is of interest (E-M1).

    Good luck.
     
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  5. gryphon1911

    gryphon1911 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Mar 13, 2014
    Central Ohio, USA
    Andrew
    First - PRO level work has nothing really to do with the camera. I worked for many years doing pro work with an old Nikon D50. I only upgraded because I wanted to have a second body for backups and there were other things I needed like weather sealing and faster FPS. Only upgrade a camera body if you need to do so because it is holding you back. Working on your photography skills nad education will net you better images than any gear will. Once you've gotten a certain level of mastery in the craft, you'll know what gear will best help you get the shots you want with the best efficiency.

    Second - most cameras struggle somewhat in low light and I'm not sure that you'll see a lot of difference going from the EP5 to an EM1 or EM5 mkII. The firmware upgrade in the EM1 is great, but is not a cure all.

    As jeffryscott mentioned, getting better lenses will be more beneficial to you than getting a different body. If you like zooms, get the 12-40/2.8 or if you want primes(my personal favorite for the wide to medium focal lengths) then I'd recommend looking into the Oly 17/25/45 f/1.8 lenses. All can be found used on in the Olympus Refurbished store for not a whole lot of money - they are worth the price though as they can be used wide open with excellent sharpness.
     
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  6. VooDoo64

    VooDoo64 Mu-43 Veteran

    240
    Jul 17, 2010
    Zagreb - Croatia
    Davor Vojvoda
    Em1 feels better in hand, all the buttons are in good position, em5mk2 with the grip wont be the same because grip just duplicate some control and other buttons are not on goid position as thay are in em1 - feel and handling is what em1 make pro and em5 semi-pro.. Next forget about focus tracking on em5mk2 because he dont have pd-af..

    You can buy em1 with 12-40 than 12-40 cost 700eur, or you can buy 12-60 and 50-200 and adapter for the price of cca 600-700 eur - with 12-40 you will have better low light af and smaller sistem abd with 12-60 and 50-200 you will have 2 great lens for fraction of the price but you wont have great low light af and its a bigger setup..

    I't is your choice - and yes i would buy em1 for pro use
     
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  7. panonski

    panonski Mu-43 Regular

    53
    Dec 13, 2014
    yes, gryphon I agree, it's not the major jump in the space because all of these cameras have almost same sensors.
    I just like to buy another camera, cause I feel like I must have it for backup. Or main, it doesn't matter.
    If I will go to shoot some weddings I will find myself somehow "killed" by having only the PEN.

    For that reason, I want an upgrade. And I must admit, Focus is very very relevant to me. I want all shoots are fine immidiatelly, so I have more time to next shoot, and have no reason to take another "same one" repeating the shooting, which is almost always the case.

    If we're talking about quality of photos, I'm already very high in that field, but must admit I have lack of experiance with models in studios.

    I recently buy two flashes, and I start to combine them, as a slaves in my photos, so I'm learning in that area.

    Also, my Pen, believe it or not, already have 35,000 shutter actuations, and I'm not sure how long it can last, in a pro levels modes, with many shoots per event.
     
  8. gryphon1911

    gryphon1911 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Mar 13, 2014
    Central Ohio, USA
    Andrew
    If you plan on shooting weddings and using the AF system, then probably your 2 best cameras right no in m43 are the Olympus OMD EM1 with the 3.0 firmware upgrade and the Panasonic GH4.
    I personally like the Oly functionality and EVF layout better than the Panasonic. My vote would be to get the EM1.
     
  9. tyrphoto

    tyrphoto Mu-43 All-Pro

    May 25, 2014
    Seoul | NYC
    ㅇtㅈyㅅr
    Like some others have said, if money is an issue, I'd spend the money on better lenses rather than upgrade from the EP5. You'll find more improvement in performance and IQ with better glass.

    If you do have other lenses or can budget in better lenses plus a body, the choice really comes down to form factor.

    Personally, I sold my EM1 not too long ago to purchase an EM5 II, which I'll be picking up at the end of the month. The grip is unnecessary for me since I only shoot primes on the Oly and would rather have a smaller camera. Of all the new features on the EM5 II, the only one that really is of great interest to me is the better OIS performance. I'm sure some of the other features will come in handy every now and then, but definitely not on a day to day basis, at least for my needs.
     
  10. Klorenzo

    Klorenzo Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 10, 2014
    Lorenzo
    If you do weddings and events for work I'd go for a couple of "pro" zooms and a good primes.
    For example the Oly 12-40 and the Pana 35-100/2.8 and the Oly 45, something like that. Autofocus speed depends A LOT on the lens, more than on the body I'd say, at least for simple AF-S.
    I think that AF is very good for all the models you are considering, and for the EP-5 too. Unless you are doing fast wildlife, sports, etc. you should be fine for all these models even in low light.
    Make sure that your problem with "bad shots" is actually focus and not motion blur: I've never had or heard of big AF problems here or around except for tracking and moving subjects. In low light motion blur is common.

    The ergonomics of the EM-1 are just better. If this is about work I'd care more about this then the latest tricks. With the 12-40 kit you should save some money.
     
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  11. tino84

    tino84 Mu-43 Veteran

    217
    Dec 29, 2013
    If AF is important to you, I really doubt you can upgrade from e-p5 with m5, they share the same AF (thought with different focus point I think, but speed would be the same), so WITH 4/3 lenses you could get an upgrade with e-m1, or with dfd on gh4 like others said.
    Otherwise, you can check for a gx7, I just tested mine against my e-pl5, and AF is much faster in all situation. quality is similar to your e-p5
     
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  12. panonski

    panonski Mu-43 Regular

    53
    Dec 13, 2014
    I read, the phase detect in OMD EM 1 is actually hybrid. And I read also that Phase Detect wouldn't work in S-AF situations. Just came from the store, but workers are not "in the thing"... So, my question about it, isn't quite answered. ...
     
  13. Mikefellh

    Mikefellh Mu-43 Top Veteran

    939
    Jun 7, 2012
    Toronto, Canada
    Too many people toss the word "pro" about and think everyone comes up with the same definition.

    For instance if I said I was a pro driver, some people might thing race cars, some limousines, some taxis, some buses, and others transport/lorries.

    There's no one definition of a pro photographer, and until the OP defines what THEY mean by "pro" no one can give a proper answer!
     
  14. Klorenzo

    Klorenzo Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 10, 2014
    Lorenzo
    I'm not sure if this matter is actually so relevant. Do you have problems of "focus hunting" or bad focus? The camera keeps hunting and never stops or focus badly?
    If you get the green square and the beep you have focus, no matter if PDAF or CDAF was used. CDAF is more accurate than PDAF but it is a little slower. PDAF focus matters most for fast action photography not to solve focus problems.

    Try a pro or fast lens and all your doubts about focus in low light will probably vanish (except for a couple of slow AF lenses, like Pana 20/1.7 or Oly 60/2.8).

    The AF of the E-M1 with the latest firmware, from all reviews and users here, is great, no matter what it uses. PDAF is mostly relevant for 43 lenses and C-AF.

    To answer your question: it's not clear if and when the E-M1 used PDAF in AF-S mode, but IF Olympus decided not to use it probably is because there is no value in using it over simple CDAF.
     
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  15. panonski

    panonski Mu-43 Regular

    53
    Dec 13, 2014
    Thank you Klorenzo, I just try here in the thread to figure it out, what to choose between the very similar cameras.
    I really don't like chunkiness of bigger bodies, the main reason I'm stick with this system is size.

    I came from pocket sized camera and if I must to choose something, I would rather to be the smaller, then bigger, but then again if I must deal with the quallity of the produced work, I will must go on that side.

    My questions are really, what really would be better to choose for semi pro work. I read here some very valuable answers, and I think the decision is for know on the OMD EM 1 side.

    ;)
     
  16. Klorenzo

    Klorenzo Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 10, 2014
    Lorenzo
    Have a look here, especially the top view with the 12-40 lens:

    http://camerasize.com/compact/#482.412,594.412,459.92,ha,f

    Obviously the best thing is to see both cameras in a shop.

    The E-M1 is a small camera. The E-M5 is a little smaller but when you add a pro lens the size difference is less important.

    I think the E-M5 is good enough for professional work. The E-M1 can be more comfortable to use. You can add an external grip to the E-M5 and get a similar comfort.
    The E-M1 could be better for sports. I do not see many other important differences.
    There is practically no difference in image quality. Lenses are more important for image quality.
     
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  17. gryphon1911

    gryphon1911 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Mar 13, 2014
    Central Ohio, USA
    Andrew
    I've discussed the issue at length with Olympus tech support and the PDAF is used when the camera algorithms feel they need it. That means in S-AF or C-AF. The problem is, probably outside the engineers who build the algorithms, no one can seem to determine when the camera will or will not use it.

    The biggest bonus you get with a PDAF system and an S-AF setting is the camera can determine which direction to initially start focusing. Early CDAF had issues with that as well as needing to pulse back and forth until it was sure it had a proper lock. Current CDAF has come a long way, especially in the m43 world, so it is not as prevalent an issue as it used to be.
     
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  18. gryphon1911

    gryphon1911 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Mar 13, 2014
    Central Ohio, USA
    Andrew
    I'll also add, that I asked if the Tech people could ask the engineers and they told me that it was a proprietary algorithm and they could not share any more than that.
     
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  19. panonski

    panonski Mu-43 Regular

    53
    Dec 13, 2014
    hmmm....very interesting thing about it...