Now Nikon is on the ropes?

JonSnih

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The Z6/7 did have other features in their favour including a superb EVF, high quality weather / dust sealing, great ergonomics, great interface and good build quality (apparently dodgy rubber grip notwithstanding)
I for one am very happy with my Z6 at the cost
These discounts go against Nikons profitability.

Rob, what do you mean by suberb EVF? Can you compare with the EVFs from the E-M1ii/iii/X? Also how do you deal with only 60 FPS refresh rate? Are there any issues over Olympus EVF with 120 FPS when shooting fast subjects? Thanks.
 

Robstar1963

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These discounts go against Nikons profitability.

Rob, what do you mean by suberb EVF? Can you compare with the EVFs from the E-M1ii/iii/X? Also how do you deal with only 60 FPS refresh rate? Are there any issues over Olympus EVF with 120 FPS when shooting fast subjects? Thanks.
Hi @JonSnih
I haven’t used the Z system for Motorsports as yet as there haven’t been any events to go to due to Covid
I bought the camera knowing that it was not ideal for Motorsports and the EVF refresh rate may compromise it’s use for same. I am quite happy with the limitations including possibly the AF performance
The discount I got was a one off 20% from a mail order company I use rather than a Nikon discount
I would highly recommend the Z6 for general photography as long as you can accept that it does not have class leading spec AF, lack of dual slots and no option of a functional battery grip
It has been fine for the few pictures I have taken so far and image quality is as expected - superb
The Z6 EVF is much better than that in those Olympus cameras you mention albeit with a lower refresh rate than some
It has a useful top screen which I actually use and appreciate and another great feature of the system is the programmable ring on most of the Z FF lenses which enable aperture to be controlled which I like in common with the Fuji system
I am really looking forward to trying out the Z6 with some fast action and I will of course be sure to update here when I have tried it out - probably at Speedway this year if Covid restrictions ease and permit such things to go ahead with spectators / photographers :thumbup:
 
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Mike Wingate

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Nikon is as good as gone. Another wuality product and classic name about to go.
just imagine if Apple were to bring out 2 models of camera each year. A small bodied 20mp and a 46mp pro model. Then every year bring out a new model. Plus a wealth of lenses. Allowing no other manufacturer to make and sell lenses. Would they be on a winner?
 

MonikaO

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Look at Nikon's stocks, not good at all and that is for all of the company.

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Hypilein

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No they wouldn't. People don't buy cameras. That's the problem current camera companies have. Apple selling cameras wouldn't change this, unless of course their two models would be part of their phone. By that definition they are already selling cameras and really successfully.
 

SpecFoto

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I personally think that Nikon were quite fair to existing Nikon owners in providing full support for most if not all F Mount lenses (ie not supporting the screw drive lenses)

My understanding is that not all of their previous DSLR cameras supported screw drive so it is not really a significant change of policy
They quite rightly want to promote a new lens Mount in order to move forward with optical technology

By ALL accounts the Z Mount offers a better Mount for increased optical transmission with very low distortion, very sharp Z Mount lenses all of which seem to be very highly rated

I believe that the majority of Nikon owners will be happy enough to have only non screw drive F Mount support
The Nikon D series of F mount lenses, I am talking the primes only, sold over 4 million copies with 16 total primes and 11 of those primes are still sold by Nikon today. 4 of the 11 there are no replacements for yet in either the G or Z series. These were the best lenses Nikon could make from 1993 thru 2008 until the first G lens was introduced (50mm f1.4G) which wasn't as sharp as the 50 1.4D and was made of plastic, where as the D series were all metal construction. Most of the other G lenses came in 2012 or later and had better quality than the 50 f1.4G. So the D lens type were a big part of Nikons sales during the last 10 years. The 3 mentioned in my 1st post are not cheap lenses, they cost me between $1,000 and $2,000 USD each.

The 3000 and 5000 series of Nikon consumer cameras were the one that did not support the D screw drive lenses as those were the cheapest DSLR's Nikon made. ALL Nikon mid, high and pro grade cameras did.

You must not shoot with a bunch of Nikon guys like I do, 7 total, all top level D810 and D850 shooters. Only 1 has bought the Z6* and he quit using it after a few months as there was no 85mm f1.4 lens yet, just a plain vanilla f1.8 lens and the AF sucked compared to his D850, which BTW Nikon said was supposed to be just as good. The lens map looks OK, but sales of the Z series has lagged for numerous reasons, some of which you mentioned, and the fact that lenses that are coming out for it are in most cases as large or larger than their D or G counterparts, and much more expensive, is not helping Nikon right now. If Nikon would have put a screw drive motor in the Z series 2-1/2 years ago, or at least provided one in their F to Z mount adapter, I would not be shooting Sony for my FF work and Nikon may have gotten some of the $10,000 or so I have invested in Sony, as it is now they got squat. :laugh1:

*Edit: Instead of getting a Z camera, 2 of my Nikon buddies have added an Olympus EM1.3 after seeing/testing mine and they both love it. One bought the 12-100 f4 Pro and the other the 12-40 & 40-150 F2.8 Pro.
 
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Biro

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Nikon may survive. But perhaps it won't be as an independent company. At some point, the Japanese government may step in to encourage a merger or recapitalization.

And, as I have posted before in other strings about the venerable company, Nikon has brought this on itself with its almost-pathological focus on protecting its traditional, top-line DSLRs from any other camera line.

This conservatism-to-a-fault lies at the feet of Nikon's marketing department and upper management. Don't blame the engineers. They have repeatedly developed great alternatives to pro-DSLRs that have been intentionally crippled by the suits.

Nikon has never even had its heart in APS-C DSLRs -- never mind mirrorless and various compacts. The Z cameras are excellent (at least the Mark II line) but Nikon just waited too long.
 

John M Flores

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Nikon may survive. But perhaps it won't be as an independent company. At some point, the Japanese government may step in to encourage a merger or recapitalization.

And, as I have posted before in other strings about the venerable company, Nikon has brought this on itself with its almost-pathological focus on protecting its traditional, top-line DSLRs from any other camera line.

This conservatism-to-a-fault lies at the feet of Nikon's marketing department and upper management. Don't blame the engineers. They have repeatedly developed great alternatives to pro-DSLRs that have been intentionally crippled by the suits.

Nikon has never even had its heart in APS-C DSLRs -- never mind mirrorless and various compacts. The Z cameras are excellent (at least the Mark II line) but Nikon just waited too long.
Yup. The Nikon brand is iconic and has value in and of itself. If it stumbles, the brand will be picked up by a Chinese, Korean, or Indian company, much like Jaguar and Land Rover are owned by Tata motors in India.
 

Sammyboy

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The Nikon D series of F mount lenses, I am talking the primes only, sold over 4 million copies with 16 total primes and 11 of those primes are still sold by Nikon today. 4 of the 11 there are no replacements for yet in either the G or Z series. These were the best lenses Nikon could make from the 1993 thru 2008 until the first G lens was introduced (50mm f1.4G) which wasn't as sharp as the 50 1.4D and was made of plastic, where as the D series were all metal construction. Most of the other G lenses came in 2012 or later and had better quality than the 50 f1.4G. So the D lens type were a big part of Nikons sales during the last 10 years. The 3 mentioned in my 1st post are not cheap lenses, they cost me between $1,000 and $2,000 USD each.

The 3000 and 5000 series of Nikon consumer cameras were the one that did not support the D screw drive lenses as those were the cheapest DSLR's Nikon made. ALL Nikon mid, high and pro grade cameras did.

You must not shoot with a bunch of Nikon guys like I do, 7 total, all top level D810 and D850 shooters. Only 1 has bought the Z6 and he quit using it after a few months as there was no 85mm f1.4 lens yet, just a plain vanilla f1.8 lens and the AF sucked compared to his D850, which BTW Nikon said was supposed to be just as good. The lens map looks OK, but sales of the Z series has lagged for numerous reasons, some of which you mentioned, and the fact that lenses that are coming out for it are in most cases as large or larger than their D or G counterparts, and much more expensive, is not helping Nikon right now. If Nikon would have put a screw drive motor in the Z series 2-1/2 years ago, or at least provided one in their F to Z mount adapter, I would not be shooting Sony for my FF work and Nikon may have gotten some of the $12,000 or so I have invested in Sony, as it is now they got squat. :laugh1:
.... I too would have bought a Z6 if it had the AF screw drive motor in it. I have many D series lenses that are outstanding .....
 
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Sad about Nikon. Was my first DSLR, and I loved the system until I found MFT. Some of my favorite photos were shot with a D7000. Tried to get a Nikon FF body to mess around with after going MFT, but once you go mirroless it’s hard to go back. Nikon was always too far behind in what consumers wanted. Slow to have decent video, slow to release affordable crop lenses, slow to mirrorless, pricing all wrong, etc. This sluggishness is ultimately what has killed them. Never used the Z, but I researched it before I bought the Sony A7iii. They were just too far behind.
 

piggsy

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Yup. The Nikon brand is iconic and has value in and of itself. If it stumbles, the brand will be picked up by a Chinese, Korean, or Indian company, much like Jaguar and Land Rover are owned by Tata motors in India.
*imagines Nikon coming out with the kind of engineering in 2021 that led to the Samsung NX1 in 2015*

Stop .. I can only get so erect.
 

Fuzzdog

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Perhaps Nikon et al. should work with cellphone companies to include their lenses on phones. I think a Nikon, Zeiss, or Leica lensed cellphone would get a lot of attention. I can even see the marketing in my head. Product placement, logos on phones, Joining the legacy with the future.
As mentioned elsewhere, Sony make quite a fuss about making sure their phones have a connection to Zeiss, and my current Huawei P30 Pro has very prominent Leica branding on the back.

As an ex-Nikon user, I'd honestly say that hearing Nikon had anything to do with making the lens on my phone might actually put me off - I love their cameras, but I've never really rated their lenses as anything special, they always get the job done but I can't remember a single Nikon lens I've thought was amazing. I still say my personal perfect camera would be a Nikon DSLR with lenses by Olympus. But then I'm also one of those weirdos who always wished Olympus would release a new 4/3 DLSR with the guts out of a modern M4/3 camera in it. 🤪
 

Brownie

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As mentioned elsewhere, Sony make quite a fuss about making sure their phones have a connection to Zeiss, and my current Huawei P30 Pro has very prominent Leica branding on the back.

As an ex-Nikon user, I'd honestly say that hearing Nikon had anything to do with making the lens on my phone might actually put me off - I love their cameras, but I've never really rated their lenses as anything special, they always get the job done but I can't remember a single Nikon lens I've thought was amazing. I still say my personal perfect camera would be a Nikon DSLR with lenses by Olympus. But then I'm also one of those weirdos who always wished Olympus would release a new 4/3 DLSR with the guts out of a modern M4/3 camera in it. 🤪
That's interesting in that Nikon is known around the world for binoculars, guns scopes, spotting scopes, commercial optics, camera lenses, and basically anything optical.. I would have to say your experience may be atypical.
 

Mack

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I learned - the hard and expensive way - that my old Nikon "Holy Trinity" set of gold-ring zooms were not that sharp compared to my recent Olympus glass. Surprised me, but 5 years in glass evolution does seem beneficial.

However, Nikon does seem to have cranked it up a bit with their newer Z mount S-series of glass that appears to be beating Canon and Sony both. Still, that may take some time to settle in for some pros to make the upgrade purchase if they ever do in the current economy.

I fear Sony may take a hit with their smaller throat diameter on current lenses even with their G glass. Their service has always been lackluster and they switch to something newer way too soon and abandon the old which may anger their current owners. Canon and Nikon have always been sort of slow to update their systems so they might be on a more steady course moving ahead.

Nikon might be smart to move into the car arena with cameras given so many of the new cars have bunches of them onboard now. Cameras for lane tracking, side cameras, braking, pedestrian, dash cams, passenger cams (Uber), theft/parking cams, fog/rain cams, and back-up cams.
 
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