My latest foray into FF mirrorless - and why I'm sticking with m43

pellicle

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I was a Canon FF shooter for years. When I switched to MFT in 2013 my back was trashed from carrying a big bag of lenses and cameras for decades. I was shooting 5Dmk2 bodies...Over the years, my back has become much less bothersome, and at the end of a long day of shooting, I can still walk and wake up the next day pain free. This is very important to me.
...
... The fact that I can carry the 50-200 PL all day, and shoot a 3 or 4 hour long event with it and not feel pain in my shoulders or back is amazing....What I have works perfectly for what I do. My needs are met.
I guess that you aren't a professional shooter for this? (assuming that's correct) Which means you don't need to satisfy clients percieved needs.

Don't get me wrong, I haven't been taking photographs for making money for many a year now, but when I did I recall that (probably because they were not competent to judge in any other way) having a big impressive camera (sadly) seemed to make clients happier at your services ... "you must be a professhional"

I now probably need to add that I have used m43 probably longer than anyone else on the forum (so that I don't get bashed by the FF haters) and its the camera I reach for when I step out (most of the time) and definitely the camera I take on a holiday.
 

wjiang

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The Nikon sure looks huge to me. Wider, longer and heavier. It's a big standard 1.8 50. No other way to say it. It's too big to hang from your neck at a botanical garden etc... Sorry, maybe you have a thicker neck. I wouldn't take the Sony 55 either. That one I have, i'd take my 15.
I couldn't hang my old E-M5 with the 25 f/1.4 on my neck... gave me neck pains. Switched to sling straps and backpack attachment and haven't looked back since. These days the neck strap stays in the box.
 

MAubrey

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The Nikon sure looks huge to me. Wider, longer and heavier. It's a big standard 1.8 50. No other way to say it. It's too big to hang from your neck at a botanical garden etc... Sorry, maybe you have a thicker neck. I wouldn't take the Sony 55 either. That one I have, i'd take my 15.
It's quite bad for your neck and spine to do that regardless of how big it is.
 

DanS

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I Have a neck strap and a wrist strap, and what I'm doing determines what I use. I use the OP/TECH uni-loop system so I can swap from one to the other because they use the same connectors.
 

wolfie

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On a humbler level when I look at some of my better shots taken on my m5.2 and my 12-40 or 40-150 Pro then I am reminded that I am the limiting factor at getting decent quality images when things dont go so well - lack of shot discipline and correct exposure are my stumbling blocks ...
 
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Actually I am a full time working pro. Been at it for 40 years. Shoot full time at a university and have a nice collection of freelance clients that keep me busy.

In the old days, yeah big ass cameras always got the client excited. Now, so long as you’re not using a phone, you must know what you’re doing. Right?

Been shooting exclusively, and professionally, with M4/3 since 2013. And started messing around with M4/3 in 2011

Mike


I guess that you aren't a professional shooter for this? (assuming that's correct) Which means you don't need to satisfy clients percieved needs.

Don't get me wrong, I haven't been taking photographs for making money for many a year now, but when I did I recall that (probably because they were not competent to judge in any other way) having a big impressive camera (sadly) seemed to make clients happier at your services ... "you must be a professhional"

I now probably need to add that I have used m43 probably longer than anyone else on the forum (so that I don't get bashed by the FF haters) and its the camera I reach for when I step out (most of the time) and definitely the camera I take on a holiday.
 

pellicle

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Actually I am a full time working pro. Been at it for 40 years. Shoot full time at a university and have a nice collection of freelance clients that keep me busy.
ahh ... interestingly I got our media production team to move from EOS to GH5 (at the uni where I worked but not as a photographer)

In the old days, yeah big ass cameras always got the client excited. Now, so long as you’re not using a phone, you must know what you’re doing. Right?
yep that's about how it seems. Although if you turned up with my GF1 and P20 they'd probably doubt that you can do the job. Most of the "talking heads" stuff we did for lecturerers introing themselves could be ably done with exactly that cos we sampled down toe 720 for student distro anyway ...

started messing around with M4/3 in 2011
yep ... I got mine barely a few years earlier
in my view ...: the Panasonic G1 (brief review and impressions)
re-reading that I see my opinion has changed about AA batteries ;-)
 

tkbslc

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Here's where I get stuck every time I consider FF:

Compact Camera Meter

Once you go past about 100mm eq. the lenses just get massive on FF.

So Ironically, I post this about FF only having huge telephotos, and then 3 days later, lo and behold, Canon's next RF mount lenses leak and look at that stubby little 70-200 F2.8 L!

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I'm sure it's heavy, and it must extend to zoom, but it's so compact for a 70-200mm f2.8. It looks like they sawed their regular EF mount one in half!

Of course I'm sure it ain't cheap.


There's also a fairly compact 24-240 f4-6.3 lens. Hopefully it performs better than Sony's. Assuming good IQ, that's like having 12-120 with f2-3.1 DOF control on m4/3.

https://www.canonrumors.co/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/canon-rf-lenses.jpg
 
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ijm5012

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So Ironically, I post this about FF only having huge telephotos, and then 3 days later, lo and behold, Canon's next RF mount lenses leak and look at that stubby little 70-200 F2.8 L!

View attachment 717408

I'm sure it's heavy, and it must extend to zoom, but it's so compact for a 70-200mm f2.8. It looks like they sawed their regular EF mount one in half!

Of course I'm sure it ain't cheap.
Very interesting. I'm curious to know how the weight will compare to something like their recently updated EF version.

I'm a fan of the extending design of Nikon's 24-70 f/4 S. It's a very solid, well built design. It's definitely a step up over previous extending lenses I've used. I'm sure Canon's mechanism will be very similar given this is one of their f/2.8 L lenses.

I look forward to seeing more detailed specs of Canon's new lens. They're definitely dumping their resources in the EOS R. Rumor is that they're releasing a high MP version in the next week or two, and then they have an even cheaper version rumored to be released later this year.
 

Reflector

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Very interesting. I'm curious to know how the weight will compare to something like their recently updated EF version.

I'm a fan of the extending design of Nikon's 24-70 f/4 S. It's a very solid, well built design. It's definitely a step up over previous extending lenses I've used. I'm sure Canon's mechanism will be very similar given this is one of their f/2.8 L lenses.

I look forward to seeing more detailed specs of Canon's new lens. They're definitely dumping their resources in the EOS R. Rumor is that they're releasing a high MP version in the next week or two, and then they have an even cheaper version rumored to be released later this year.
Here's a closer look from one of the low resolution images. It doesn't look like it is a telescoping (to get into a ready to shoot state) design

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tkbslc

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There's just no way to fit 200mm f2.8 inside that lens body if you ask me. I would bet it is like their 70-300L, which does extend, but doesn't necessarily look like it does from afar.
 

Reflector

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There's just no way to fit 200mm f2.8 inside that lens body if you ask me. I would bet it is like their 70-300L, which does extend, but doesn't necessarily look like it does from afar.
I doubt that it looks like that at 200mm f/2.8. It probably does extend but I will end up printing this post and eating it if it somehow is an internally zooming design.
 
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It is not the equipment you have but what you do with it that counts. A friend of mine has the original Panasonic mu43 camera - he takes some amazing photos. It is not all about the latest and greatest. Sometimes, not having the latest and greatest makes you more creative.
 

ac12

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Here's a closer look from one of the low resolution images. It doesn't look like it is a telescoping (to get into a ready to shoot state) design

View attachment 717419
I agree, it looks too short to be a 70-200 internal zoom lens.
The lens is at 70mm, so the shortest position for an extending zoom.
The junction for the extending barrel could either be in the black collar (where you cannot see the line) or at the edge of the zoom ring.
 

ac12

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I agree, it looks too short to be a 70-200 internal zoom lens.
The lens is at 70mm, so the shortest position for an extending zoom.
The junction for the extending barrel could either be in the black collar (where you cannot see the line) or at the edge of the zoom ring.
BTW, manufacturers rarely show an extending lens at full extension.
And all specs that I've seen are with the lens in collapsed position.
 

inthecage

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Go to Las Vegas, look around at all the Asian tourists, American tourists with neck straps. Perhaps they are 'lowly' Rebel users with their Costco specials. How terrible we true camera aficionados know.....with heavy sarcasm. There was a day you could get a film camera with 50 1.8 that you could take out and about that way. A Z6 and the 50 1.8s would be absurd around the neck. I suppose Nikon is saying that's the territory of Camera phones now. They are wrong and are giving up on the green pastures of millions of enthusiasts. With the 4 big players of FF mirrorless, they don't have a lot of ground to give up on. I have a Sony FF mirrorless and a 55. It's a bit better size wise, but I guess the reason why we are on this webpage is because of M43. My Pen F and my 15mm lens fill that gap. Quite well I might add.
 

davidzvi

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My take on m4/3 vs APS-C vs FF?

Use the tool that works for you as long as you can actually explain WHY it works for you. My current m4/3 and Fuji APS-C kits work for me. The m4/3 kit offers me the incredible IBIS, weather sealing, speed, incredible lens options, and fun tech options others have already been mentioned. The Fuji is actually my smaller kit, I only have 2 primes and 2 zooms covering 22-78mm eq. It's a nice rangefinder with a little better ISO, Fuji color, and a different shooting experience I enjoy.

Currently I have no need something like the D500 or a FF system. If I were still shooting events I'd still have my rolling bag FF Nikons. If I were going to start doing them again? I'd probably re-buy Nikon DSLR FF gear. Why? It does what I need easily and I can use it without having to think about how to use it. I typically have enough other things to think about why should I have to think about how to use my gear? And it has phase AF-C with a mature flash system and that flash system has an infrared AF assist that just works on a dark dance floor, even with flashing lights.
 

pellicle

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Hi

I have a Sony FF mirrorless and a 55. ... My Pen F and my 15mm lens fill that gap..
Out of interest have you ever done a side by side with both systems and a similar prime?

One of these was taken (both on a tripod) with my GF1+P20 and the other with my A7+Sam35f2.8

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Both wide open, both developed with ACR using the same settings. Even if I could load the 4000pixel wide images PPing won't really tell them apart any better nor noise either cos they're both ISO 100 ... of course the file names give them away but if that's the only way to tell then ... ;-)
 
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