Mu-43 Post Processing Challenges - Objectives/Rules/Criteria Discussion Thread (Draft Template in 1st Post) Draft Template now here at top of OP to make it easier to find. **Template Start --------------------------------------------------------------------- Draft v0.2 [Title Box] Mu-43 Post Processing Challenge #nn [\Title Box] followed by :- BBCode Link to unprocessed JPEG image to display in-post so everyone can see what is on offer. Any explanation or commentary the Challenger wants to give (optional) Download link to RAW file (unless only JPEG available) Download link to unprocessed Original size JPEG (so "non-RAW" PP'ers can still participate, and for JPEG Shooters) Winner shall be announced on or shortly after the [Date/Time/Timezone] Mu-43 PP Challenge Rules [<-- Bold & Underline tags] The Challenger will provide any photo that he/she deems worthy of challenging other members to "improve" by way Post Processing. It must be their own photo, and taken with m4/3 equipment. "Improve" is a subjective term, and includes many creative ideas as well as traditional "fixing". The Challenger agrees that entrants may make any changes they deem fit to post in their entry. The winner of the previous challenge gets to post the next Challenge and serves as the judge for his/her PP challenge. For obvious purposes, the judge is disqualified from participating in his/her own PP challenge. Instead, he/she should post a photo to start out the challenge. Should the winner not be able to commit to being the next challenger/judge, the responsibility is passed on to the runner-up. At the end of the 100-hours (we don't have to be strict about 100-hours, especially with time differences depending on where you are on the globe), the judge will name a winner, a first runner-up, and a second runner-up. Entrants [<-- Bold & Underline tags] The Challenger's image is posted for the sole purpose of the PP Challenge; it is not posted to invite Critique or Criticism. Entries shall be limited to 2 per member for each Challenge. Entrants to post a BBCode link to the Large size image of their PP edit(s), preferably 1024px x npx, or npx x 1024px, if the original image and/or the PP edit allow for these sizes. Also a click-through to the original sized hosted edit if appropriate (but not a requirement for entry). If you post your entry to a photo-hosting site such as Flickr, Photobucket, or a Gallery, etc., please credit the original photographer to make it clear it is not your photograph; something like "Photo taken by xxxxxx over at Mu-43.com" should suffice. Entrants are strongly encouraged to post the settings and techniques used for their entry, however this is not a requirement for entry. As we all know, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. We may not all agree with the chosen winners, but the judges decision is final without adverse comment from the Entrants; the judge is encouraged (but not required) to state what criteria he used to decide on a winner. To make sure we don't break any Mu-43 rules/regulations, by participating in the PP Challenge you are allowing the judge to re-post your image for the sole purpose of announcing the winners in the thread. Link to Mu-43 PP Challenge Rules/Template --------------------------------------------------------------------- **Template End Original 1st Post -------------------------------------------------------------------------- I opened this thread to contain discussions about the recently formed PP Challenges which were conceived originally by BAXTING; to keep debates out of the challenge threads themselves, which should be confined to the images, edits, judging, results. I presume this is the best section to open it in, so people can find it easily in the Contests and Challenges, but if not appropriate a Mod can move it. In a recent PP Challenge, a member opined that the image put up for the challenge was not of sufficient quality (my words not theirs) for a challenge. No finger pointing here, I'm actually grateful for their posts as this caused me to think hard about what the objectives are/should be for these PP challenges, and the criteria for images put up as challenges; and it may be that I have misunderstood what they were saying anyway, but I think it's worth clarifying going forward. To me, the purposes of the PP Challenges are possibly threefold (or more) :- 1. To learn, stretch, and improve our PP skills by :- a. Experimentation of using unfamiliar toolset features on other people's images b. Seeing what and how other people do things 2. To Showcase what we can do with our current level of skills 3. To have fun !! :smile: The poster said this in one of the posts - "To me post processing is about making a good photo better, not about saving a bad photo." Now, I actually agree with with this when PP'ing your own photos. But, I don't think this should be the sole criteria for the PP Challenges, let me explain. Of course, it should go without saying that we should endevour to capture our images right, first time, and only do minimal PP on them afterwards (unless we are deliberately going for special after-effects); but that is not what we are posting for PP Challenges. In my own workflow on Import, I go through all the images for that shoot, marking the keepers and discarding the rest. So, by definition, in my own processing, I only have "good" images to work on. If I want to think about 1., above, to really delve into some of the technical features, and learn more about applying these recovery features, it is useful to see some other difficult images to practice on - and learn. Most of my own images (hopefully ) won't need this level of skill/knowledge, but learning about the feature and using it will come in useful someday. Having others explain how it was better to do some local noise reduction on an area of an image, rather than just apply the slider to the whole image will help people in the future, for example. You won't get all of this by just offering up "good" images, in my opinion, or only to a lesser extent. I know you can read tutorials, and watch videos for some of this stuff, but I find I learn better when getting my hands dirty, and it's much more fun in the company of like-minded people !! If I think about my own recent challenge that I posted, I would not have been able to set this challenge if the criteria were "good" images. In fact, I was lucky to have this difficult image; it was only because I was experimenting that I kept it, normally an image like this would have been in the discard pile. I myself got two good different images from this RAW file, so I knew there was something there, and I was very interested to see what others would do with it; there were some very good and interesting edits. Here are some categories of images that I feel would all be very appropriate for the PP Challenges :- 1. A sub-par image that you could not fix - "Here you go, fix that if you can". There's a challenge if ever I heard one. 2. A sub-par image that you did fix, but would like to see what others can do with it too. 3. A well exposed, noise free etc., image, but you are not too happy about the composition. What can others do creatively to bring more out, give a different feel to? 4. A "good" image that you are pretty happy with overall, but would like to see other people's creativity go wild on. There are probably others, but I'm just illustrating a point. I'm not saying, either, that people should include the category of their image when posting their challenge, although they could explain if they wanted to. Of course, it would be good to have an ongoing mix of types in the challenges, it would be somewhat repetitive after a while if we always only got one type of image to work on. When, and if, after debate, we get some consensus on how these challenges should progress, perhaps we can put some of what we agree by way of explanation to new posters in an expanded "rules" part that goes in the first posts of the challenges, and expand/add anything to the rules themselves if we need to? Where would we maintain the rules, criteria, etc., so they are easily found and updated if necessary? Apologies for this long ramble but, hopefully, somewhere in here I've got enough of my point across to be understood. Feel free to join in, add your own thoughts and suggestions, violently disagree, or just say we don't need to do anything. Maybe you see these challenges as just showcasing your ability without any explanation? It would be good to hear other people's thinking on these challenges, as opposed to just my own ramblings.