Discussion in 'This or That?' started by dixeyk, Apr 30, 2012.

  1. dixeyk

    dixeyk Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 9, 2010
    I believe the OMD is a probably the best m43 camera to have come out thus far. It really delivers on the promise of m43. I also have no plans to get one because I have a mantra when it comes to gear.

    1. Never buy new camera bodies. As cool as it is new gear does not automatically mean old gear stops working or is no longer capable of great results. My E-P2 cost about an eighth of what it did when new and my GH2 about half (although technically I didn't buy it I traded for it).

    1b. If you MUST buy new spend it on lenses.

    2. Like all electronic gear m43 cameras suffer from an abundance of enthusiastic early adopters and a good deal of hype. Its fun to read and even dream about having it but wait six months and you're looking at MUCH less cost.

    2b. In six months a lot of early adopter will be selling the gear that is HOT right now because there will be new HOTTER gear out with it's own abundance of enthusiasm and hype. You'd be amazed how much low mileage gear will pop up.

    3. Whenever you start to get into those conversations with yourself about how you NEED a certain bit of new gear go out and take pictures with some of your OLD gear. Remind yourself why you bought it in the first place.

    4. Sometimes you will not like the new gear that everyone else thinks is great. There is nothing wrong with you, I have yet to have anyone ask me what camera I used to shoot something (that wasn't a board member here since we seem to have a particular fondness for that question).

    4b. Buy the gear that makes you want to go out and make images. If its the newest, latest and If it's the uncool, much maligned P.O.S. that everyone hates...also good.

    4c. I operate a strict gear in needs to be paid for by gear out model (as I am sure many of us do). I figure in 2 years that I am probably no more than $100 off of where I started. I've tried a lot of gear and found stuff I like and some that I really don't but it's like playing black jack with house money.
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  2. penfan2010

    penfan2010 Mu-43 All-Pro

    Nov 12, 2010
    NJ, USA
    Dixeyk - I believe we've traded thoughts along the lines of those outlined in your mantra. Amen to all! What's also helped me is to see many folks on the forum shooting great photos with their E-P1s, G1s or E-PL1s.

    I think the most important part of your mantra, to paraphrase, is to shoot what you like, with what you like to shoot with.
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  3. dixeyk

    dixeyk Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 9, 2010

    Yeah that pretty much covers it. I would however add to your paraphrasing...

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  4. Luckypenguin

    Luckypenguin .

    Oct 9, 2010
    Brisbane, Australia
    Real Name:
    You know, for six years this was my mantra. Until this year I hadn't bought a new camera or lens since 2006. I was often trading up, down, and sideways looking for the best deal first and the best equipment second. I got (beyond) where I wanted in the end but I am well tired of the process. Having decided to do a cleanout of DSLR gear this year, I want to have a much smaller, more focused (no pun intended), and up-to-date kit. So I strayed from the mantra and spent some of the proceeds (actual and projected) from the DSLRs on some new gear, but only gear that I really wanted and intended to keep around for a while. It's fun having something brand new again after so long, but not so fun that I will jump permanently on the constant upgrade bandwagon :wink:.
    • Like Like x 3
  5. dixeyk

    dixeyk Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 9, 2010
    Yeah, it can be pretty tiring. I think. I use it a way to keep myself focused (there's that unintentional pun again:eek:) on making images rather than collecting gear. I have a closet full of compact RF cameras from the last time I let it get out of hand. I'm like a gear equivalent of a binge drinker. That said, if the OMD had an articulating LCD I'd be really tempted. :biggrin:
  6. mbbinvt

    mbbinvt Mu-43 Regular

    Mar 28, 2012
    Thanks for sharing your mantra, dixeyk. Perfect timing for me. I recently jumped into m43 photography when I bought a pl2. I'm really liking it, but I've really been impressed with the low- light samples from the EM5. Wow! But your mantra echoes the little voice in the back of my mind that says, "What's the rush? Take a few months and see if you really 'need' this upgrade?" I'm sure there will be plenty of new and used EM5s on the market come fall or even next spring.

    dixeyk, you said you prefer to buy used cameras and new lenses. I have to admit I take the opposite tack on the assumption that more can go wrong with the electronics of a camera than with a lens, but perhaps that is a holdover from my old SLR film days when I got some great used Nikkor lenses real cheap. In the digital world, have used cameras become more reliable than used glass?

  7. dixeyk

    dixeyk Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 9, 2010
    I actually tend to buy used lenses as well but I figure if I am going to buy new it'll be new. That said, I have found the used bodies to be very reliable. of course it helps that early adopters tend to sell their cameras with really low mileage on them.
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  8. Minniesmum

    Minniesmum Mu-43 Veteran

    Mar 2, 2012
    Me too...I've bought new - rarely- but any used digital bodies I have bought, no problems whatsoever .
  9. addieleman

    addieleman Mu-43 All-Pro

    Aug 5, 2010
    The Netherlands
    Real Name:
    Years ago I only bought cameras second-hand from well-reputed stores under warranty because too much can be wrong with an SLR. I've never had reservations on buying second-hand MF lenses OTOH.

    Now with the mirrorless cameras there's much less that can be wrong and remains unnoticed during quick-testing: no mirrorbox or focus screen can be misaligned. Of course, a camera may still have gotten a serious knock whereby the bayonet flange is not perfectly parallel anymore, or similar stuff. Don't laugh, I've had a Nikon F3 that had to be repaired for this, fortunately under warranty! These days cameras depreciate very rapidly in value, so I think I'd still buy it second-hand under warranty.
  10. Liamness

    Liamness Mu-43 Veteran

    Apr 20, 2011
    Great post, these two points in particular resonated with me.

    It's easy to feel that your gear is mediocre. I think a lot of people feel this way with any technology, but particularly with cameras it's impossible to not run down the feature list of a new model, and feel that itch. The new EM-5 has so many features my GF1 doesn't have. I've taken tons of great photos with my GF1 though, and I'm sure I'll take many more. It's a matter of getting off the internet and shooting some photos, then the itch will disappear.

    Photography is a hobby for most of us, so we need to remember that while pulling the trigger on that new purchase might make us feel good, that is money that can't be spent on anything else. I sold my Canon equipment to make the move to m43, and from what I have read, many of you did something similar. I do feel the need to keep the amount of gear I have in check, as it would be a waste to have so much stuff that I can't possibly use it all regularly.
  11. kinlau

    kinlau Mu-43 Top Veteran

    Feb 29, 2012
    And those fanboys are touchy.
  12. mbbinvt

    mbbinvt Mu-43 Regular

    Mar 28, 2012

    Is there a rule of thumb for how much a camera depreciates each year? How much will those E-M5s cost in a year when early adopters of that camera become early abandoners of it in favor of the E-M6?

    Also, am I right that you can get an E-M5 body for about $850? I'm figuring I could buy the body with kit lens for $1,100 at B&H, then sell the lens for about $250.

    I'm not pulling the trigger on one of those cameras. I'm only asking so I have a baseline to compare future prices of the body against. I'm hoping that in 6-12 months I might be able to pick up a minty E-M5 for less than $600. (Where's the "fingers crossed" emoticon?)
  13. dixeyk

    dixeyk Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 9, 2010
    That is an understatement
  14. dhazeghi

    dhazeghi Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 6, 2010
    San Jose, CA
    Real Name:
    There's no way to know for sure. The best estimates involved looking at what happened previously with similar models. As the E-M5 is Olympus' first up-market m4/3, this is a bit harder than usual.

    My suspicion is that the E-M5 will not be replaced as quickly as the Pen. Higher-end models traditionally have longer release cycles, so my guess is that you won't be seeing an E-M6 for 18-24 months. That should slow the depreciation process - I'd be surprised if it dropped more than 35% over that period.

    Unlikely. I've never seen it go for more than $150 secondhand.

  15. dhazeghi

    dhazeghi Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 6, 2010
    San Jose, CA
    Real Name:
    It's the unmaligned P.O.S. (E-620, I'm looking at you) that get me into trouble.

    Seriously though, a lot of good points. My major rule of thumb (which I've violated several times):

    It's not enough to like the camera (or the lens), you have to like the results too.​

    It's easy to get sucked into the fun of 'new' and 'great' gear and later realize that the photos aren't what you're looking for. Which in the end is the whole point (or at least it's supposed to be).

  16. dixeyk

    dixeyk Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 9, 2010
    I agreed, it's really tough to figure. Take the E-P3 for instance, it seems to have dropped in price more quickly (in the shortest period of time) than any of the other PEN cameras you're seeing really nice ones going for just over $500 yes it was introduced less than a year ago. Then on the opposite end you had the GF1 retain its value for a really long time. It also depends on what the competition does. If the GH3 is priced aggressively (and is on a par with the OMD as I expect it will be) then I should think the OMD will come down a bit in response. There is also the very real possibility that Olympus will introduce more OMD models (like they did when the introduced the EPL series on the heels of the EP series.

    If I were to guess I'd say within 6-8 months we could see used OMD prices down in the $600 range.