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Looking for Defunct Micro 4/3 Bodies for a Good Cause

Discussion in 'Micro 4/3 News and Rumors' started by Amin Sabet, Sep 5, 2012.

  1. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Apr 10, 2009
    Boston, MA (USA)
    I'm working with a company to develop a process to convert Micro 4/3 cameras to monochrome by removing the color filter array. Many Canon sensors died horrible deaths when they were learning to do this with Canon DSLRs, and the same will almost certainly be true with Micro 4/3, so we are looking for sensors they can use for practice.

    If you have a completely defunct Micro 4/3 body that is beyond repair (fell into river, runover by car, etc) and would consider donating it for this purpose, please let me know!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Linh

    Linh Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 14, 2009
    Maryland, US
    We should just lobby oly or panasonic to do this w/ the latest 12MP sensor in EPL3/G3 body =)
     
  3. MikeR_GF1

    MikeR_GF1 Mu-43 Veteran

    I "killed" a number of cameras in attempting to do an IR conversion. Easy enough to remove the AA/IR piece, but I caused a lot of collateral damage getting to it. Removing the Bayer filter would, I think, be a much more delicate operation.

    Is the company getting close to having a service available?
     
  4. jloden

    jloden Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 15, 2012
    Hunterdon County, NJ
    Jay
  5. Chrisnmn

    Chrisnmn Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 26, 2012
    Auckland, New Zealand
    Chris
    If you get to make it work, id love to get an EPM1 converted to monochrome with the soon to be released O15!. just for the fun of it!.
     
  6. Jonathan F/2

    Jonathan F/2 Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 10, 2011
    Los Angeles, CA
    GF2/EPL1 bodies seem pretty cheap to come by!
     
  7. soulofoto

    soulofoto Mu-43 Regular

    62
    Mar 21, 2012
    what is this monochrome conversion? why do it?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. LovinTheEP2

    LovinTheEP2 Mu-43 Top Veteran

    619
    Feb 15, 2011
    Toronto
    I have been wanting to convert my EP2 but no one seems to have the process down yet from the 2 major convertors.

    soulofoto

    1. Part of the process removes the AA filter (which depending on which body of M43s you have - can significantly degrade IQ due to the significant blurring to control Moire. On the EP1 and EP2, the AA filter is quite thick and reduces IQ.

    2. By removing the 3-color Bayer filter array, you increase the resolution significantly for 2 reasons. Moire concerns are gone since there is no repeating color arrange on the filter array so no need for the AA blur which helps alot with micro contrast etc. 2. Increased resolution. see below.

    Think of every pixel as either red blue green.. so a 14mp sensor is really just 4ish MP per color (in a 6x6 array there are 36 pixels: 9 blue, 18 green and 9 red. So now every pixel is discrete unit vs assigned to 1/3 of the color filters. So you get a higher resolution image.

    That's why the FOVEAN had resolution advantage as each pixel resolved all 3 colors; hence why FOVEAN makes certain claims about xMP and people say not really. There only X number of pixels.. whether you stack the 3 color filters or dividie them up into 3 seperate color pixels. Pixel number shouldn't change but FOVEAN multiples it by 3 to represent how each pixel samples each color.
     
  9. Aegon

    Aegon Mu-43 Veteran

    334
    Nov 3, 2011
    Portland, OR
    LensRentals.com - MM MM Good?
    The M9 peak MTF is 1260, the B&W MM peak MTF is 2050. Read the article closely for the many caveats, but basically switching from a bayer array (4 sensels per pixel) to a luminance-only array approximately doubles resolving power and also reduces the appearance of noise.

    This would be great on an E-PM1 or GF2/3.
     
  10. kwalsh

    kwalsh Mu-43 Top Veteran

    775
    Mar 3, 2012
    Baltimore, MD
    You can read a bit more about such conversions here:

    B&W Conversion
     
  11. jloden

    jloden Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 15, 2012
    Hunterdon County, NJ
    Jay
    Wow, I had no idea B&W conversions were even an option before seeing this thread. Now that I'm learning more about it, I could totally see doing that with a previous generation camera body.

    I really like B&W shots in certain circumstances anyway, and for that kind of jump in IQ that would be fantastic too!
     
  12. One thing to remember with a monochrome-only sensor is that you lose the ability to adjust the strength of the different colour channels in post processing. If you want the effect of a yellow filter for example, you need to have a yellow filter physically mounted on the lens.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  13. RedNumber5

    RedNumber5 Mu-43 Regular

    158
    Dec 13, 2010
    Antioch, CA
    I've been thinking about doing an IR conversion on my G1 since buying a GH-2 but a monochrome conversion would be another choice I would go to if the price is about the same as an IR conversion. I think monochrome would be better for me but I'd have to see examples to see if it would be worth it.
     
  14. st3v4nt

    st3v4nt Mu-43 Veteran

    317
    May 26, 2011
    Jakarta, Indonesia
    After read this thread I keep thinking somehow Olympus or Panasonic read about this and releasing the camera for monochrome picture and called it PEN-Mono™ or Lumix-Mono™ it will shake the market a lot.
     
  15. KVG

    KVG Banned User

    May 10, 2011
    yyc(Calgary, AB)
    Kelly Gibbons
    I don't have a camera to donate, but I will get one for conversion when it is available as I primarily shoot b&w:2thumbs:
     
  16. Linh

    Linh Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 14, 2009
    Maryland, US
    maybe we should start a fund to buy up old broken stuff? Though, that would also depend on the estimated cost to do one of these conversions once a process was in place.
     
  17. dhazeghi

    dhazeghi Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 6, 2010
    San Jose, CA
    Dara
    There are a few folks who've done it successfully. IIRC they used strong (industrial strength) solvents to dissolve the Bayer array.

    A friend of mine accidentally converted a D80 to IR+visible by using the wrong cleaning solution. Completely dissolved the IR filter. I suppose it's the same story with the Bayer array.

    DH
     
  18. blue

    blue Mu-43 Veteran

    280
    Jun 1, 2010
    UK
    I'd be very interested in a momochrone m43, in a G1 body though not one of the PENs.
     
  19. twokatmew

    twokatmew Mu-43 All-Pro

    Jun 1, 2012
    Lansing, MI, US
    Margaret
    +1
     
  20. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Apr 10, 2009
    Boston, MA (USA)
    This is the company I've been talking to: B&W Conversion

    They already sell converted Canon DSLRs, but that's it. Many Canon DSLRs died for them to offer these, and as you can see from the order form, they charge quite a bit for the converted ones. The main fellow there told me that removing the Bayer array is 100 times harder than doing an IR conversion. I think he said that when doing the procedure on Canon 5Ds, he destroyed the first several sensors, was successful on the 4th or 5th try, and then destroyed the next 8 or so before having another success :eek:.

    I spoke to a contact at Panasonic, and they are going to try and get some damaged cameras for us to use for this purpose. I'll speak with Olympus folks as well.