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Lens designs

Discussion in 'Native Lenses' started by zulfur666, May 9, 2014.

  1. zulfur666

    zulfur666 Mu-43 Veteran

    254
    Jan 30, 2014
    Being a huge fan of technology improvement, hence I like mu43 cameras and lenses designed from the ground up not just a mere re-design. Wouldn't it be time to use Carbon fibre for lens body instead of metal or plastic? yes it would make the lens more expensive but for premium lenses such as Panasonic's 35-100 f/2.8 or Oly 12-40 2.8 etc it would greatly reduce weight even further.
    Any thoughts?
     
  2. OzRay

    OzRay Mu-43 Legend

    Jan 29, 2010
    South Gippsland, Australia
    Ray, not Oz
    The production costs for carbon fibre would far outweigh any potential benefits (if there were any) and carbon fibre isn't the magical product for all things.
     
  3. b_rubenstein

    b_rubenstein Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 20, 2012
    Melbourne, FL
    Take a course in material science when you go to college.
     
  4. T N Args

    T N Args Agent Photocateur

    Dec 3, 2013
    Adelaide, Australia
    call me Arg
    Carbon fibre's real advantage is where you need strength in combination with weight. A lens body is not an environment that demands a high-strength material. So, you won't save much weight because CF is not super-light in itself, only in comparison to strength.
     
  5. b_rubenstein

    b_rubenstein Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 20, 2012
    Melbourne, FL
    Weight and strength are secondary properties for the mechanical parts in a lens assembly.
     
  6. LowriderS10

    LowriderS10 Monkey with a camera.

    May 19, 2013
    Canada
    While I'm a huge fan of CF, it's simply not a smart way for lens makers to spend their money (or, more likely, increase the cost of the final product). The cost-benefit ratio on this one is severely tilted towards the "cost" side of things. ;)
     
  7. Replytoken

    Replytoken Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 7, 2012
    Puget Sound
    Ken
    You might think twice aboout a CF body on a lens if it is accidentially dropped. CF can shatter upon impact. I'll stick with metal or plastic.

    --Ken
     
  8. dhazeghi

    dhazeghi Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 6, 2010
    San Jose, CA
    Dara
    Canon and now Nikon have been working on making their exotic telephotos (400/2.8, 600/4) lighter, but they haven't used CF at all. If it doesn't make sense for a 4kg $8k lens, I really doubt it's going to help with a 0.5kg $1k one.
     
  9. speedandstyle

    speedandstyle Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    I think a composite fiber used to reinforce the plastic used in the lens body would be a good idea, especially at certain stress points. It may be they are used in this way in some lenses, it is not uncommon in high end plastic products. The fibers don't have to be expensive carbon however to work well, glass, nylon or even polyester fibers can add extra strength. The fibers are molded in with the plastic itself and not layered as they are with carbon fiber{as it is commonly thought of}.

    Carbon fiber would look killer on a lens however! :cool:
     
  10. Ian.

    Ian. Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 13, 2013
    Munich
    Ian
    Yes agree. We use glass fibres in plastic designs and you wouldn't know it. It is injection moulded ready to assemble. If the carbon fibre was used, as vehicles and planes are, in layers, it would be expensive for a lens body. You'd need to machine them before assembly.

    Now coat a plastic body with a "Carbon fibre look" skin, and people will "feel" it's lighter.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Ned

    Ned Mu-43 Legend

    Jul 18, 2010
    Alberta, Canada
    My lenses don't need to be lighter, they just need to be more durable. Stop using plastic, and go back to more metal is all I ask. Compact metal lenses are no issue for me. I loved the rangefinder ones.
     
  12. Ned

    Ned Mu-43 Legend

    Jul 18, 2010
    Alberta, Canada
    Funny thing, I was up on the rooftop with some of my photographer friends over the weekend and I accidentally dropped one of my all-metal SLR lenses on the gravel from about chest high. Everybody's jaw dropped, but I didn't even flinch as I just picked it up and and put it back on the camera without even bothering to look at it. This lens also had a metal hood on. There's nothing a little drop like that could do, lol. XD
     
  13. dhazeghi

    dhazeghi Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 6, 2010
    San Jose, CA
    Dara
    Odd. I've had more trouble with dropping metal objects than high quality polycarbonate ones. In several cases, the metal has deformed, whereas the polycarbonate does an excellent job absorbing and dispersing the energy of the fall.
     
  14. Ned

    Ned Mu-43 Legend

    Jul 18, 2010
    Alberta, Canada
    Well, there is a big dent in this particular metal lens hood, which has been there since before I got it. ;)
     
  15. Ian.

    Ian. Mu-43 All-Pro

    Mar 13, 2013
    Munich
    Ian
    Aluminium is very light. And on the short focal length big aperture lenses half of the weight is the glass lenses. But aluminium is susceptible to denting. I dropped and dented an aluminium 500mm mirror lens once, writing it off. Ouch!
    Plastic is not inherently a bad material. It gets used in more and more things that we consider high quality.
     
  16. Ned

    Ned Mu-43 Legend

    Jul 18, 2010
    Alberta, Canada
    Yeah, the older lenses tended to use aluminum but I think the most common metal for newer metal lenses is Magnesium Alloy. Your heavier pro-grade lenses all use a lot of metal (not all metal), and are durable as hell.
     
  17. dhazeghi

    dhazeghi Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Aug 6, 2010
    San Jose, CA
    Dara
    I'm not sure where you'd classify the 12-40/2.8, but it's a combination of plastics and aluminum. The aluminum scratches surprisingly easily.
     
  18. pdk42

    pdk42 One of the "Eh?" team

    Jan 11, 2013
    Leamington Spa, UK
    I wonder what the weight proportions between glass/electronics and barrel are in the higher-end lenses? At a guess, I'd guess the barrel isn't the major weight element. Personally, I'm not convinced that metal is any more durable, but it looks prettier.
     
  19. CiaranCReilly

    CiaranCReilly Mu-43 Veteran

    481
    Oct 18, 2012
    Dublin
    Ciaran Reilly
    Carbon fibre would be nice for looks and marketing reasons, would be cool to see some manufacturer using it as a structural element of a lens, if only just 'cos they can!
     
  20. nstelemark

    nstelemark Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    May 28, 2013
    Halifax, Nova Scotia Canada
    Larry
    CF is not particularly durable when it suffers an impact, bad choice for a lens body. I would also bet the bulk of the weight in most lenses is in the glass.