iPhone influence on Field of View

Discussion in 'Open Discussion' started by drd1135, Jun 21, 2013.

  1. drd1135

    drd1135 Zen Snapshooter

    Mar 17, 2011
    Southwest Virginia
    Steve
    I received an email from Adorama with the usual collection of cleverly intermixed articles and advertisements. I was looking through a comparison of the Sigma DP-1 Merrill, the Nikon Coolpix A, and the Ricoh GR. Reasonable review, but he ended with the following statement:

    The Smart Phone Effect

    One final question that I am sure is to come up is why 28mm? With the amazing popularity of the Apple iPhone, 28mm has become the de facto standard of modern snapshot photography. Those upgrading from the iPhone will be right at home with the 28mm FOV these three cameras provide, and is a smart decision by all three makers.

    Just as a matter of discussion, do you believe that camera phones have indeed had this influence on the snapshooter community?
     
  2. dav1dz

    dav1dz Mu-43 Top Veteran

    926
    Nov 6, 2012
    Canada
    It has. Most of my friends don't have a compact camera anymore. The ones that do are often the water proof rugged models or older models. It's just smartphones now. More often than not an iPhone because since iPhone 4 they've had a great image processor.

    Though I wish these fixed lens cameras are 35 mm and not 28 mm. Ricoh does have a cropped mode though, which is cool
     
  3. drd1135

    drd1135 Zen Snapshooter

    Mar 17, 2011
    Southwest Virginia
    Steve
    What I find interesting is that the 28mm FoV is quite a bit wider than what I normally associate with low end P&S cameras. This is basically saying that the iPhone &Associates have retrained the public to "see" in a different FoV.
     
  4. robbie36

    robbie36 Mu-43 All-Pro

    Sep 25, 2010
    Bangkok
    rob collins
    This quite a complicated one.

    I mean it is a bit of an assumption that the iphone sets the standard when Android sells more phone. The Samsung S4 actually has a FOV of 32mm (35mm equiv).

    Next it is also a huge assumption that I want a fixed lens camera with the same FOV as the smartphone camera that I already have in my pocket but that is another matter.

    Then there is FOV and FOV... By that I mean if you have a 34mm 4:3 sensor, then when it is cropped 16:9 you actually have a FOV of 28mm. To me that would sort of make sense as a camera phone FOV.

    However, by and large smartphone sensors are 4:3 so if you crop 3:2 (which is how it appears I think on the iphone screen) then the actual FOV is even smaller - 25mm.
     
  5. madogvelkor

    madogvelkor Mu-43 Top Veteran

    937
    Feb 22, 2013
    Connecticut
    I think my Atrix 2's FOV is about 35mm equivalent.

    The 28mm FOV is probably better for phone cameras given the way people use them -- you can make close up group shots or selfies easier. :)
     
  6. dav1dz

    dav1dz Mu-43 Top Veteran

    926
    Nov 6, 2012
    Canada
    iPhones are all around 30 to 35mm equivalents. As far as I know? I could be wrong.

    Update: Flickr reported equivalent focal lengths: iPhone 5 @ 33 mm, iPhone 4S @ 35 mm, iPhone 4 unknown but same nominal focal length of 4.3 mm as iPhone 4S.
     
  7. Steven

    Steven Mu-43 All-Pro

    May 25, 2012
    USA
    I have often wondered how many people are becoming more interested in photography these days because they discover their phone happens to have a camera, but as they start using it they are not really happy with image quality. Maybe the camera makers are wondering this too and are hoping to capture some of that market.
    We talk about phone cameras killing dedicated cameras, but is it possible there's a small movement in the opposite direction as well?
     
  8. madogvelkor

    madogvelkor Mu-43 Top Veteran

    937
    Feb 22, 2013
    Connecticut
    I think kit zooms on DSLRs have had more of an impact on making 28mm the default FOV for fixed lens cameras than camera phones have. Pretty much every kit zoom starts around 28mm these days. And those that don't start even wider, at a 24mm equivalent.

    My feeling is that it is easier to crop a shot than to make it wider, so manufacturers err on the side of a wider lens. A bit different than film days when 35mm was a good compromise FOV that satisfied a lot of people's needs.
     
  9. phidauex

    phidauex Mu-43 Regular

    76
    Jun 17, 2013
    Boulder, CO
    While Android phones may be more numerous, they are mostly not used for their camera functions (since the quality varies so much between manufacturers). iPhones, 4, 4S and 5 have all had very good cameras (for their size).

    Take a look at this Flickr stats page showing popularity of different cameras. The iPhone 4S is the most popular camera of any kind, and the 4, 4S and 5 are the top three most popular in the smartphone category, with the Samsung Galaxy SIII trailing a ways behind.

    Flickr: Camera Finder

    This is one of those things about smartphone features - just because it exists on the spec sheet doesn't mean people will actually use it - mobile safari still dominates mobile traffic, not because there are more iphones, but because people with iphones use their browsers more. Same situation with cameras.
     
  10. battleaxe

    battleaxe Mu-43 Top Veteran

    I would agree with the aforementioned statement that the kit zoom has to a lot with; but, it is not just the kit zoom, most compact cameras start in at 28mm or wider these days, with higher end and more advanced models starting at 22-25mm range. I remember when I purchase a Canon S2IS super zoom the starting focal length was 34mm I think, and when it came time to get a new camera(this was when the G2 was a few months old), most cameras were starting at a wider 28mm range.

    Not to get off topic here, but I am not fully sure how accurate that statement is, seeing as on Android you have more browser choices, not to mention default browser varies from manufacture to manufacture(like Samsung bundles their own browser, HTC their own browser, while a Nexus device will come with stock browser(I think) and Chrome.
     
  11. Savas K

    Savas K Mu-43 Top Veteran

    784
    Jan 10, 2013
    I don't think it has; or if it did, it would be self-destructive to the snap shoot makers. It's like lowering a standalone camera's capability down to the lowest common denominator in order to meet the limitations of a popular format that only is popular because it tags along as part of what limitation a popular phone offers.
     
  12. CiaranCReilly

    CiaranCReilly Mu-43 Veteran

    481
    Oct 18, 2012
    Dublin
    Ciaran Reilly
    The Ricoh GRD has always been 28mm since way before smartphone cameras, and I'd take a guess that the Nikon A is designed to compete with the GRD, while the Sigma DP is offerred in a range of FOVs. I wonder which DP is the best seller?

    In my opinion, 28mm is "wide enough" to fit in what "most people" want in a shot, whether it's a selfie, interior shot or landscape, while as the FOV narrows, things get cut out and frustration ensues. So for smartphones I think it is a lowest common denominator thing designed to keep as many people as possible happy, while for high end compacts perhaps it's a trend Ricoh started?
     
  13. madogvelkor

    madogvelkor Mu-43 Top Veteran

    937
    Feb 22, 2013
    Connecticut
    Yeah, walking around town with a GF3 I've used the 14mm, 17mm, and 19mm lens at various times. It is definitely easier to get a shot with the 14mm, especially of buildings or groups of people. The 17mm and especially 19mm force more creative thinking though, which I like. But for the average user a 28mm equivalent is going to let them get the shot without too much thinking about angles or foot zooming. Then they can crop a little at home (or in camera in some cases).
     
  14. Chrisnmn

    Chrisnmn Mu-43 All-Pro

    Apr 26, 2012
    Auckland, New Zealand
    Chris
    Please lets not transform this quite interesting thread into an iPhone vs android one. The op asked if the smart phones (all of them, not which one) cameras fov have influenced how people 'see' through a camera. I believe the answer is a big and clear YES. and please we are talking about regular people not all the people, cause that would include photographers as well and they are not part of the question. If phones have a 20,30,40 or 50mm fov yes that have had an impact when those people go into the market to search for a better option than their phones. And I think its an interesting experiment.
     
  15. CiaranCReilly

    CiaranCReilly Mu-43 Veteran

    481
    Oct 18, 2012
    Dublin
    Ciaran Reilly
    Here where I am (Ireland, expandable to UK also I think), when people want a better option to their phones, nowadays they invariably default to a DSLR or mirrorless with zoom lens (I know some who have gone Nikon 1 and Sony NEX), never prime or fixed lens. In my opinion, fixed lens cameras are strictly photography enthusiast cameras, and I feel the current crop of 28mm equivalents developed independently of smartphones.

    Now, whether these smartphone upgraders use their kit lens at 28mm equivalent is another question, I wonder would someone be able to query Flickr for this info, i.e. the most common focal length out of all photos taken with entry level DSLRs?
     
  16. htc

    htc Mu-43 Top Veteran

    579
    Jan 11, 2011
    Finland
    Harry
    Yes it has, kind of! At least my own. It also shows the fact that the best camera is what you have with you. What ever FL or FOV. Means that you use what you have with you. At least I do.

    It's also kind of liberating feeling, because it's not real camera that you have. It's camera-kind-of-thing, at least from a camera freak point of view.

    Then I liberate myself even more by weaken them even more with Instagram.

    Results are some what different but joy to make. At least to myself :rolleyes:

    Instagram

    EDIT: Thinking that question second time: nothing has changed in my field of view thinking. I just use what I have with me. Some times FOV it's too narrow, mostly too wide. I just take photos that suits to that FL. What ever FL.
     
  17. Savas K

    Savas K Mu-43 Top Veteran

    784
    Jan 10, 2013
    The author postulates that the camera doesn't matter. I guess that is true to a degree, but do we all agree that the smartphone offers it's best when the light is ideal? What about when the light is not?






     
  18. RajC

    RajC Mu-43 Regular

    82
    Jul 6, 2013
    Narcists


    This is a huge factor. As one who has studied and worked extensively in the field of social media, the "me" factor is huge. As has been stated, a wide angle allows self-portraits. I would bet that the majority of photos taken on a cell phone are of the user.

    As for the stats about camera use, we need to consider social media platforms in developing countries.
    As a former iPhone user, I also agree that the variety afforded non- iPhone users skews results.
     
  19. brettmaxwell

    brettmaxwell Mu-43 Veteran

    350
    Dec 8, 2012
    That's been my observation as well.