E-P7 Leaked

hoodlum

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To be honest, I never expected anything new or groundbreaking in an entry level camera, at least not in terms of hardware. Maybe better integration with smartphones on the software side of things, some sort of live streaming and things like that. But that doesn't seem to be the case either. I am also somewhat disappointed by the older Micro-USB connector, sure it's still great you can charge the battery inside the body, but I mean it's mid 2021, a USB-C connector should be standard as of today, even most entry level phones come equiped with one.

Also the price:
The E-P7 sells for EUR 899 as a kit with the 12-42mm EZ lens. The E-M10 Mark IV sells for EUR 849 with the same lens and is currently on sale for EUR 799. Comparing body only prices is even more obvious: 799 for the new Pen, 689 for the latest E-M10. Unless somebody really want the smaller and compact body or is attracted by the design and JPEG options, I personally see little reason buying this over the E-M10 Mark IV.
I wonder if this is due to some type of currency adjustment on new Olympus EU product since the E-M10iv was released. In Japan the E-P7 costs less than the E-M10IV on the Olympus Japan site.
 

betamax

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it's really not a lot different from the E-P5 of 2013. Uprated sensor and a few bells and whistles
The E-P5 was an E-M5 without WR. So, had that followed through, the E-P7 should have have been an E-M5iii without WR, but the ‘pro’ in the pen line. ie, the two dials, check. Phase detect AF, nope. 1/8000th shutter, nope. Hires mode, nope? EVF option, nope.

This new E-P is more like an E-PL than an E-P series camera, and I'm hoping that's to make room for the Pen-Fii, based off the E-M5iii. Well, that's my hope....
 
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I hope you're right, as E-M1X size is not my personal preference. Maybe they'll release two new models, to appeal to a wider range of customers.
Yeah I agree. The E-M1s are an OK size. I have mine mostly for the weather sealing and features. If this camera had an EVF it would have been tempting anyway. PDAF too. The 1X is absolutely opposite of the direction I'm going :)

For me wow is going to be something no bigger than what I have now, a new sensor (not necessarily so much in megapixels but in quality) and something I enjoy doing in a vastly superior way.

What won't wow me is a high price point (with ~$4k in equipment my bar is pretty high) or minor updates of existing tech.

Hoping for the best!
 

hazwing

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Other than the E-M5III?

That's not much larger than the E-P7, only bigger in the EVF hump and LCD screen hinge for all intents.
Yeah I would be happy with a em5 mk3 size. But still no phase detection af in the current model. Not sure how long of a wait it will before we see a mark 4
 

mawz

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Yeah I would be happy with a em5 mk3 size. But still no phase detection af in the current model. Not sure how long of a wait it will before we see a mark 4

The E-M5 III most certainly does have PDAF. That was the major upgrade on the Mark III vs the mark II (it lost the bigger EVF and tethering support to get PDAF)
 

hazwing

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The E-M5 III most certainly does have PDAF. That was the major upgrade on the Mark III vs the mark II (it lost the bigger EVF and tethering support to get PDAF)
Oh sorry, my bad. I must have gotten it confused. Does it have continuous eye detect autofocus? (not S-AF eye detect) I might have gotten the two things mixed up.
 

mawz

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Oh sorry, my bad. I must have gotten it confused. Does it have continuous eye detect autofocus? (not S-AF eye detect) I might have gotten the two things mixed up.

Not sure (not something I'd ever use, my subjects are very rarely human), AF is reportedly identical to the E-M1 Mark II so if the E-M1 II has it, the E-M5 III should too.
 

doady

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Seems people were expecting way too much from this camera. It's not called Pen F II, so why expect it to be a Pen F II? Pen F already has the latest sensor, so what major improvement could Pen F II even offer, especially before a new iteration of the flagship E-M1X series?

I think people just expecting too much from new cameras in general. I think that time is over, and it has been over for a while now. Like, my E-M1 II is a 5 year old model, and I can't imagine replacing it just because of better technology. I'll probably be using until it breaks, maybe the rest of my life.
 

Mike Wingate

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I have had a second email from Olympus about the new E-P7. Todays email offering the O45mm f1.8, for only £1.00 if I place an order for the E-P7 before June 21st. Reading everything, the last paragraph offering the 45mm F1.8 prime lens worth £249 absolutely free. Am I being ripped off buy a £1?
 

mawz

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Are Olympus in trouble, they gave away a free lens with a camera body purchase last year and are doing so now?

No, it's not uncommon for there to be packages like this when the manufacturer is trying to build a little buzz.

Nikon has been bundling free FTZ adapters on and off with various Z bodies (and that adapter is not cheap at list)

The Panasonic S5 launched with a free Sigma 45mm deal for example.
 

PakkyT

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I think people just expecting too much from new cameras in general. I think that time is over, and it has been over for a while now. Like, my E-M1 II is a 5 year old model, and I can't imagine replacing it just because of better technology. I'll probably be using until it breaks, maybe the rest of my life.
So by your argument OMDS and any other camera company's business model should be make something good enough for thier customers and once they all get one, go out of business? :confused-53:

Clearly a for profit business's business model is to continue to create new products that are designed to entice the market to buy the new products and that is done by making the new products different or better or cuter or smaller or bigger or whatever is needed to generate interest than the previous/current products. So ya, having a company that only releases a handful of products a year, it is not unreasonable to expect them to raise the bar with those few new products. When said company then seems to "mail it in" with what appears to be rather incremental updates to a previous camera the two thoughts many have is "that's it?" followed by "then why did it take so long to release?". Really if these minimal updates are what are to be expected in the Pen line, then these releases should be every 6-12 months, not years between models.
 

demiro

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...
Clearly a for profit business's business model is to continue to create new products that are designed to entice the market to buy the new products and that is done by making the new products different or better or cuter or smaller or bigger or whatever is needed to generate interest than the previous/current products....
This is the issue that underlies much of the negativity or frustration with m4/3s. Sony is the technology leader and continues to innovate, like them or not. Canon and Nikon are fully embracing mirrorless, which drives enthusiasm for those brands. Not sure about Fuji, but they seem to happily occupy a niche.

Panasonic is more than ever about video, it seems, and FF seems to be a larger priority than m4/3s. Then there is OMDS. Big questions exist in the post-Olympus world. Add to that the lack of real opportunity to innovate and what do you get? The E-P7, it would seem. I'm not trying to ring the "m4/3s is dead" bell, but it sure seems to be on a path to a very small niche existence at best.

Minus a game-changing development, I think the only question is how long do they last in current format?
 

doady

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So by your argument OMDS and any other camera company's business model should be make something good enough for thier customers and once they all get one, go out of business? :confused-53:

Clearly a for profit business's business model is to continue to create new products that are designed to entice the market to buy the new products and that is done by making the new products different or better or cuter or smaller or bigger or whatever is needed to generate interest than the previous/current products. So ya, having a company that only releases a handful of products a year, it is not unreasonable to expect them to raise the bar with those few new products. When said company then seems to "mail it in" with what appears to be rather incremental updates to a previous camera the two thoughts many have is "that's it?" followed by "then why did it take so long to release?". Really if these minimal updates are what are to be expected in the Pen line, then these releases should be every 6-12 months, not years between models.
There's more to the camera business than bodies. There's lenses as well.

If there is a Pen F II, it will be an incremental update as well, same way E-M1 III was an incremental update. It's not the 00s anymore, the technological advancements have slowed, digital photography has matured and stabilized. For long-term survival, the companies will have to accept that fact and we as consumers have to accept that fact as well.

I think people unwilling to accept that fact is what's been really driving the current obsession with full frame. But what next? Medium format? Large format? It has to stop somewhere.
 
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If this incremental update becomes "the norm", then why upgrade from mkII to mkIII? Just wait few more generation until the upgrade is worth (e.g it really makes a difference from your mkII). Why selling your mkII at a loos and buy (new) the mkIII, just to sell it at a loss to buy the mkIV and so on? The market is already overflown with camera gear. I think this incremental update will not work, and I don't know how committed is OMDS to really innovate and bring something fresh on the market (e.g to invest money).
Nevertheless, I don't think any of those new releases are OMDS babies, they are the Oly's last ones.
 

PakkyT

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There's more to the camera business than bodies. There's lenses as well.
Sure but I was responding to your specific comment of (bold emphasis mine)...

think people just expecting too much from new cameras in general.

Oly/OMDS generally do a much better job with new lenses but then that is usually because the lenses are often something very different to fill a gap in the line up (adding to the line up, not replacing something else in the line up), where as with bodies they are generally meant to replace an older body.


It's not the 00s anymore, the technological advancements have slowed, digital photography has matured and stabilized. For long-term survival, the companies will have to accept that fact and we as consumers have to accept that fact as well.
No they don't and no we don't. Technological advances only slow when you don't have much vision to innovate or you are simply trying to squeeze something new out of the same old stuff rather than looking for new ways to do things (again lack of innovation). This happens all the time with older established companies who try to push out the same crap over and over again, then along comes some new company that completely rethinks it and puts out something new and refreshing. Now the old companies scramble to catch up.

It has to stop somewhere.

No it doesn't. I mean if you think companies should just toddle along pushing out a new shiny polish on a new trinket that is really just the old trinket in disguise, well then I guess you must be thrilled with the E-P7. You can't be disappointed if your expectations are low, right?

I mean how embarrassing is it that the latest body from OMDS being released in 2021 uses a micro USB B port and only supports USB2 connectivity? Are they serious? USB2 was a "legacy" port a decade ago. So really if they can not incorporate an off the shelf newer port technology how you can we expect to get excited or expect anything innovative is going to be present when actually taking of photo in this "new" (ancient) model? And this isn't because technology is slowing down, it is because Oly/OMDS are years behind.

The silver lining is I believe most of these recent releases are really Olympus pipeline stuff that OMDS inherited and may not represent the new lean & unencumbered company that the CEO/Chief/President (who ever it was) indicated in interviews will free them to do more than they were able to do under Olympus. Unfortunately this will take some time to see that innovation and in the meantime we will be "wow'd" /s by Olympus corporation era ideas of what new or improved means.
 
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I think the great thing about this discussion is how obviously passionate we are about this platform.

We know that it is possible to take great pictures, professional pictures, on a platform much smaller and lighter than "full frame." We have a great community, awesome lenses. If we had listened to conventional wisdom and bought APS-C or full-frame, our experiences would be poorer for it.

But, if we had listened to conventional wisdom, we would not be on a platform at risk of dying... And frankly, that's where we are at.

I don't know about you, but to me that's stressful. I mean in one sense, it doesn't matter. Our equipment won't stop working (any time soon anyway). For a time people will make new lenses, later on it will become legacy. Are there still people that shoot 4/3rds or OM-System? I'm sure.

That I think is why we're passionate. If M43 goes away, what replaces it? Scary answer? Nothing.

I don't know the conversations at OMDS. Maybe for the first camera, they went ultra-conservative. Maybe the goal was to show that another company could make Olympus cameras of the same quality. Maybe there were time constraints. Frankly, I wonder if Olympus made this camera, but gave it to the new company so they could put something new out immediately. I don't know.

What I do get concerned about - I don't see this drawing in new people. The 8-25/f4 I think has some value - new glass, small, light, but weather sealed. Seems like a good companion to the other f4 pros out there. Not going to work for me, but it's part of a vision.

I guess I remain hopeful that the wow comes. I hope OMDS has people with a vision that can succeed where Olympus failed. We have a great system - let's see where they go...
 

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