Debating on 'downsizing' from G9 to EM1iii...

Generationfourth

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I find the G9 pretty much perfect but having a 'grass is greener' moment with Olympus:
  1. I think the G9 is acceptable in size/weight for the features it offers, but I find myself saying "I wish this were 10% smaller/lighter" quite often. I feel like the EM1 now offers more camera for me for less weight. I don't have a smaller rangefinder m43 body anymore and planned on bringing the G9 backpacking and on travel trips. I've currently been taking it on mountain bike rides which can be ~3,000 ft elevation gain/20 miles. I don't carry dedicated camera bags so every gram/millimeter I save goes a long way. I'm willing to sacrifice some of the luxuries of the G9... top plate LCD, Extra FN buttons, EVF (I think, I'll have to try it out). Also, in some casual situations I find the G9 to have a DSLR presence whereas the em1 seems a little more low key.
  2. Features that cater to my "Tripodless" ethos: I think HHHR would be a lot more useful (currently I've taken 3 high res photos with G9... inside my house). LiveND: I come across countless streams while hiking and backpacking but never take ND's or tripod and it's a shame because I used to really like shooting long exposures with water. Opportunity here to carry less but expand my photography...
  3. Night/Astro- Currently I may try a long exposure at night but quickly get lazy and give it up. And I really don't like going through the PP to composite star trails, etc. The live composite/bulb modes look like amazing feature set.
  4. I'm quite happy with the G9 for low light/fast action but interested in what Oly AF/burst can do.
  5. 8 way joystick- the 4 way on the G9 bothers me and is slooooowwww
  6. Battery life, weather sealing, better IBIS (with my Panny lenses?)- I don't think the G9 is a slouch in any of these areas but could always use more
In short, I think #1-3 make it worth carrying a ~600 gram body around, whereas I find the G9 to be overkill if I don't specifically need fast burst/AF.

Downsides:
  1. Cost, flipping the G9 for the EM1iii... there is a pretty big price difference
  2. All my main lenses are Panasonic: 8-18, 12-35, 35-100, 100-400, but I don't think this is as big a deal nowadays. (Specifically wondering if this affects any of the features listed above- I know I probably can't do the handheld focus stacking)
  3. Oly menus/usability- I tried an em5ii 5 years ago. I loved it but there was some usability issues that were a dealbreaker for me. However it seems like there have been some improvements (my menu, better touch implementation). There will be a learning curve and not sure if I want to give up my familiarity/mastery of the G9- I'm sooo fast with it.
I'm just airing this out, I plan on renting one to be sure but I want to know if anyone went from the G9 to the EM1...

I'm grateful for any sensible input!
 

John King

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I have the E-1, E-30, E-510, E-M1 MkI, E-M1 MkII and E-PM2.

I can assure you that "only 10% difference" makes a very noticeable difference in both bulk and mass.

The E-M1 MkII + 12-100 is almost the same weight as my E-30 + 14-54 MkII. It feels smaller in the hand! Solely because of the balance. The E-M1 MkII is smaller and lighter, the 12-100 is larger and heavier. The balance is better.

When I really want tiny, the E-PM2 + either f/1.8 25 or 14-42 EZ.

But I can and have used the E-PM2 + 12-100. It works really well.
 

Generationfourth

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I can assure you that "only 10% difference" makes a very noticeable difference in both bulk and mass.

The E-M1 MkII + 12-100 is almost the same weight as my E-30 + 14-54 MkII. It feels smaller in the hand! Solely because of the balance. The E-M1 MkII is smaller and lighter, the 12-100 is larger and heavier. The balance is better.
Yes this is what I’m curious about... ergonomics. I find the g9 to have lots of control but gets uncomfortable over a longer period of time. I think this is partly my fault because I have bad form, I tend to handle it like my previous smaller bodies with mostly one hand. The em1 looks smaller in side by sides and is 15% lighter. For the 100-400 I could get the grip of its an issue.
 

retiredfromlife

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Since you have so many Panasonic lenses, especially the 100-400 i would be reluctant to get rid of the G9
I have tried the G9 and Pany 100-400 and it was quiet easy to use. Fast forward i now own the EM1.3 and Oly 100-400 and it much harder for me to use.
Considering how much you would probably get for the G9 i would hang on to it.

The menu on the latest Oly camras are better spaced with far less menu layers (nesting) but apart from that not much difference. But now the flagship models have the my menu as well.

One thing i wish oly had is the ability to back up your settings to an SD card. Oly flagship cameras only backup to your PC and for the EM1.3 to your phone. Ñot sure about the phone backup on other models

If it were me i would keep the G9, and start an Oly kit as well, or get the Panasonic G90 as a light weight option.

I have a kit from both, the G85 and 14-140 being my light weight kit, and Oly kit for specialised purposes

Probably i have not helped much, these decisions are always hard
 
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wjiang

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I wouldn't worry about Panasonic lenses. I have the PL8-18, 35-100 f/2.8 II, PL100-400 and use them all on my E-M1 Mk2 just fine. I bought all the lenses knowing that I would use them on an Olympus body. I never really considered switching to Olympus telephotos because they are significantly bigger and heavier.
 

RAH

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I also routinely use Pany lenses on my E-M5.3 (and earlier, the E-M10.2) and have no problems. I use the PL 12-60 (my main "standard" lens); the 8-18; 12-35 (former main "standard lens"); 15mm; 20mm. Admittedly, these are not as "extreme" as the 100-400 lenses from P and O (I have the O), but these standard lenses work great.
 

Hypilein

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I wouldn't worry about Panasonic lenses. I have the PL8-18, 35-100 f/2.8 II, PL100-400 and use them all on my E-M1 Mk2 just fine. I bought all the lenses knowing that I would use them on an Olympus body. I never really considered switching to Olympus telephotos because they are significantly bigger and heavier.


It's one of the mysteries in life that while Olympus has larger lenses Panasonic has much larger pro bodies, so if you want the smallest but most capable kit you need to mix brands.

Come on Panasonic. Give us a decent GX10!
 

Generationfourth

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I wouldn't worry about Panasonic lenses. I have the PL8-18, 35-100 f/2.8 II, PL100-400 and use them all on my E-M1 Mk2 just fine. I bought all the lenses knowing that I would use them on an Olympus body. I never really considered switching to Olympus telephotos because they are significantly bigger and heavier.

So on the longer lenses you just use lens I.S.? Wondering what I should use on my 35-100 2.8 i
 

RAH

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So on the longer lenses you just use lens I.S.? Wondering what I should use on my 35-100 2.8 i
I think the general recommendation is that you use in-body stabilization for shorter FL, lens IS for longer ones. For 35-100 on an Oly body, I think I'd use IBIS, just because it's easier to just leave the camera set that way for anything. If you go longer than maybe 200, then maybe lens is better?
 

wjiang

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So on the longer lenses you just use lens I.S.? Wondering what I should use on my 35-100 2.8 i
I noticed a lot of Panasonic telephotos have more distinct vignetting wide open. Extreme IBIS movements exacerbate this for action shots. OIS tends to handle this a bit better, IMO, even if it might be inferior to 5-axis IBIS at moderate focal lengths for static shots.
 

D7k1

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I would not give up my G9's at this point in time. But I shoot video also. Also type II highres from the test's I've seen are the best for images that have any movement as it performs what Adobe calls "remove ghosts" and thing like leaves and water look natural.
 

Michael Meissner

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Well there is always my hot button topic, the EVF.

The Panasonic G9 has an OLED viewfinder, while the E-m1 mark III has a TFT LCD viewfinder. Olympus TFT LCD viewfinders will distort the view when you shoot in the horizontal (landscape) orientation and use polarized sunglasses. If you shoot in vertical orientation (portrait) there is no distortion with polarized sunglasses. Note, due to migraines, I have to wear polarized sunglasses ALL of the time when I'm outdoors in daylight.

With most of the Olympus TFT LCD viewfinders, the distortion is a series of horizontal waves, where one wave has no distortion, and the next wave is pretty bad. But two of the viewfinders (E-m5 mark II and the add-on VF-2 viewfinder for older cameras), are completely opaque in horizontal orientation when viewed through polarized sunglasses.

I find in practice, I could frame the shot and let the auto focus mechanism do its thing, but it was annoying. So in my last camera upgrade, I went with the E-m5 mark III which has an OLED viewfinder. But in doing so, I did have to give up a few things that I could have gotten with the E-m1 mark III:
  • battery grip when I need the extra power;
  • ability to power the camera with USB C-PD;
  • deeper grip for holding heavy lenses;
  • headphone jack for monitoring video sound recording; (and)
  • stronger tripod plate.
In comparing cameras with OLED and TFT LCD viewfinders, I find:
  • TFT LCD viewfinders seem to have more 'natural' colors, while OLED tends to be supersaturated;
  • While I find OLED monitors to be a little supersatured, they do have a truer black than TFT LCD monitors;
  • TFT LCD viewfinders can refresh faster than OLED (though G9 claims to have a new OLED viewfinder with faster refresh rates). I have seen reports by other migraine sufferers that are more sensitive to the refresh rate than I am, and they found the TFT LCD viewfinders to be easier to use;
  • OLED monitors have a wider angle of view than TFT LCD monitors, but I'm not sure that for an EVF it matters;
  • In general, the OLED viewfinders tend to be slightly more power hungry than TFT LCD viewfinders; (and)
  • For computer monitors & TVs, long term use tends to show that OLED monitors fail before TFT LCD. In particular OLED monitors over times tend to lose color fidelity first (particularly blue). Now for camera EVF's, I'm not sure it matters as much, since most folks probably don't shoot enough for the monitor to start failing. Those that do shoot that much tend to refresh their cameras every few years, so they may not see it (the poor schulb that buys their used camera might see it).
 
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Michael Meissner

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I would not give up my G9's at this point in time. But I shoot video also. Also type II highres from the test's I've seen are the best for images that have any movement as it performs what Adobe calls "remove ghosts" and thing like leaves and water look natural.
For me, the G9 (and all Olympus cameras) have a fatal flaw with video that normal videos are limited to 30 minutes. When the G9 came out, I was thinking of replacing the G85 I use for video recording with the G9 until I discovered the video limit.

I record live shows for friends that often do not fit into 30 minute windows. Sometimes it just goes a few minutes over (such as my niece's wedding that ran to 35 minutes), sometimes I record the whole show (1.5 hours) as one take. If you are recording shorter things or things where you can do multiple shots and combine in editing, then the 30 minute limit isn't an issue.
 

RAH

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Also type II highres from the test's I've seen are the best for images that have any movement as it performs what Adobe calls "remove ghosts" and thing like leaves and water look natural.
Yes, I have seen examples of that and think it looks very helpful. Too bad we can't get a combined E-M1 HHHR plus the Pany type II regular hi-res!

On the subject of the G9's size, I will say that I would probably have purchased a G9 if it were the size of an E-M1.3. So yeah, that extra 10% matters, at least to me. For the price difference, I'd give up HHHR (and get the type II hi-res); it's too bad about that size. :(

I think the Pany S5 has that type II hi-res; in fact, there is an example of how it fixes results on the DPreview website (I think in a "first looks" review). Very useful.
 

Darmok N Jalad

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What do you shoot when you go one rides? Would just a lighter set of lenses make a difference? Like if your aim is landscape, the P20 or PL15 are small and light. The G9 will feel as light as a feather with prime lenses such as those.
 

RAH

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What do you shoot when you go one rides? Would just a lighter set of lenses make a difference? Like if your aim is landscape, the P20 or PL15 are small and light. The G9 will feel as light as a feather with prime lenses such as those.
Well, yes, of course. But I already have an E-M5.3, so this is partially GAS. It comes down to asthetics and what might make a person pull the trigger on a camera they don't actually need but would like to have. I have a Canon 80D and am just so done with large bodies that the G9 just doesn't make it for me, especially considering that it is a m43. :)

Also, I am hoping that Panasonic is reading this thread and thinking hmmmm... They have a golden opportunity here to get a big jump on Olympus by bringing out the G10 with a new sensor, HHHR, slightly smaller body (I mean, gee, that LCD window on the top is nice and all, but I can live without it!), etc. Hint, hint...
 

Darmok N Jalad

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Well, yes, of course. But I already have an E-M5.3, so this is partially GAS. It comes down to asthetics and what might make a person pull the trigger on a camera they don't actually need but would like to have. I have a Canon 80D and am just so done with large bodies that the G9 just doesn't make it for me, especially considering that it is a m43. :)

Also, I am hoping that Panasonic is reading this thread and thinking hmmmm... They have a golden opportunity here to get a big jump on Olympus by bringing out the G10 with a new sensor, HHHR, slightly smaller body (I mean, gee, that LCD window on the top is nice and all, but I can live without it!), etc. Hint, hint...
Yeah, the top LCD really wasn't a value factor for me with the G9. Its layout and tank-like construction were, however.
 

doady

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I wish I had E-M1 Mark III instead of Mark II: extra stop of IS, AF joystick, handheld hi-res, live ND are all really cool features, but do I really need them? Ultimately we are talking about minor differences, and it's probably the same with G9 vs. E-M1 III. E-M1 III does seem like an amazing camera, but E-M1 IV will be even more amazing. E-M1 II and G9 are just slightly less amazing.

I think we should be happy with what we already have, and keep our experiences in mind for our next purchase, when we actually need to make it. When G10 or G11 or E-M1 IV or V are released, you will have an even better idea what you actually want. There is no need to rush.

15 years ago I wanted E-330. 13 years ago I wanted LX3. 10 years ago I wanted E-P3. 6 years ago I wanted LX100. 5 years ago I wanted Pen-F. 15 months ago I wanted E-M1 II (which was what I finally decided on). It never ends. There will always be something better. We will never be satisfied 100%.
 

Generationfourth

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I would not give up my G9's at this point in time. But I shoot video also. Also type II highres from the test's I've seen are the best for images that have any movement as it performs what Adobe calls "remove ghosts" and thing like leaves and water look natural.

Yeah mode 2 is quite impressive, I did use this to photograph trees that were being blown around with 20mph winds and couldn’t tell with mode 2.

Though I would trade it off for the composite/bulb feature. A firmware update for hhhr mode 2 would be welcome on the g9
Well there is always my hot button topic, the EVF.

The Panasonic G9 has an OLED viewfinder, while the E-m1 mark III has a TFT LCD viewfinder. Olympus TFT LCD viewfinders will distort the view when you shoot in the horizontal (landscape) orientation and use polarized sunglasses. If you shoot in vertical orientation (portrait) there is no distortion with polarized sunglasses. Note, due to migraines, I have to wear polarized sunglasses ALL of the time when I'm outdoors in daylight.

With most of the Olympus TFT LCD viewfinders, the distortion is a series of horizontal waves, where one wave has no distortion, and the next wave is pretty bad. But two of the viewfinders (E-m5 mark II and the add-on VF-2 viewfinder for older cameras), are completely opaque in horizontal orientation when viewed through polarized sunglasses.

I find in practice, I could frame the shot and let the auto focus mechanism do its thing, but it was annoying. So in my last camera upgrade, I went with the E-m5 mark III which has an OLED viewfinder. But in doing so, I did have to give up a few things that I could have gotten with the E-m1 mark III:
  • battery grip when I need the extra power;
  • ability to power the camera with USB C-PD;
  • deeper grip for holding heavy lenses;
  • headphone jack for monitoring video sound recording; (and)
  • stronger tripod plate.
In comparing cameras with OLED and TFT LCD viewfinders, I find:
  • TFT LCD viewfinders seem to have more 'natural' colors, while OLED tends to be supersaturated;
  • While I find OLED monitors to be a little supersatured, they do have a truer black than TFT LCD monitors;
  • TFT LCD viewfinders can refresh faster than OLED (though G9 claims to have a new OLED viewfinder with faster refresh rates). I have seen reports by other migraine sufferers that are more sensitive to the refresh rate than I am, and they found the TFT LCD viewfinders to be easier to use;
  • OLED monitors have a wider angle of view than TFT LCD monitors, but I'm not sure that for an EVF it matters;
  • In general, the OLED viewfinders tend to be slightly more power hungry than TFT LCD viewfinders; (and)
  • For computer monitors & TVs, long term use tends to show that OLED monitors fail before TFT LCD. In particular OLED monitors over times tend to lose color fidelity first (particularly blue). Now for camera EVF's, I'm not sure it matters as much, since most folks probably don't shoot enough for the monitor to start failing. Those that do shoot that much tend to refresh their cameras every few years, so they may not see it (the poor schulb that buys their used camera might see it).
I’m quite spoiled by the EVFs in the GX8 and G9. Though I have been shooting sans evf on my GF1 and it’s given me a fresh perspective:). I take off my sunglasses when shooting but you do have good points on OLED vs LCD. I’m highly curious and I won’t know until I actually look through one.
 

Generationfourth

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What do you shoot when you go one rides? Would just a lighter set of lenses make a difference? Like if your aim is landscape, the P20 or PL15 are small and light. The G9 will feel as light as a feather with prime lenses such as those.
I’ve been taking one lens typically the 8-18 or 35-100. I would like to take both on backpacking because of the weather sealing. I did take many a landscapes on the 20mm and had other compacts but going through the pro zoom lens phase.
 

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