Capture One and Olympus E-M10 colors

Discussion in 'Image Processing' started by SojiOkita, Jun 17, 2015.

  1. SojiOkita

    SojiOkita Mu-43 Top Veteran

    620
    Feb 23, 2014
    France
    I am still in my trial period for Capture One 8, trying to know if this software can be an alternative to Lightroom 6 that I currenlty use.

    I always read that Capture One have a good color rendition and good skin tones, and for my GM1 it's true, the color profiles are a little better (to my taste) than with Lightroom.

    However, for my E-M10, that is now my main camera, I find it very hard to have something pleasing.
    All my images have a yellowish tint that it hard to remove.

    When I compare the same picture taken with my Canon 40D, my GM1 and my E-M10, the Canon one looks good, the GM1 one is OK, and the E-M10 one has this yellowish tint...

    Does anyone have the same problems?
    Or do you like Olympus E-M10 color rendition in C1 ?
     
  2. David A

    David A Mu-43 All-Pro

    Sep 30, 2011
    Brisbane, Australia
    Don't know about Capture One but I've discovered a new feature regarding white balance in LR6 which I'm finding quite useful with my E-M1.

    Up until LR6, you had a choice of setting colour temp and tint by moving the sliders, or selecting auto or a range of fixed white balance options from a drop down menu. Those options are still there in LR6 but there's now a new option as well. If you hold down "Shift" on the Mac (don't know about the key for Windows) and then double click on the "Temp" or "Tint" label for the 2 sliders, LR will do an auto adjustment for just that slider so now you can actually get LR to automatically set temperature without changing the as shot tint or automatically set the tint while not changing the as shot temperature.

    I'm finding with my E-M1 that I actually like the temperature that the camera sets but I tend to prefer the tint that LR sets using this technique. Don't know why that should be but if you're not happy with the colours you're getting in LR6 you could try experimenting with this to see if you like the result any more.
     
  3. SojiOkita

    SojiOkita Mu-43 Top Veteran

    620
    Feb 23, 2014
    France
    I'm happy with the color I get in Lightroom (for my E-M10, I'm not completely satisfied with my GM1 but it is still acceptable).
    I just want to test other software to see where I can go when Lightroom will only be available with the CC subscription.

    Concerning the "Shift + Clic" hint, it works for nearly every slider (not just the WB, you can use it for exposure and so on) and I think you can even record a setting that is "as shot WB + auto tint".

    With my E-M10, I find that in LR the temperature is often too cold and the tint often too low... but it's quite easy to fix.
     
  4. David A

    David A Mu-43 All-Pro

    Sep 30, 2011
    Brisbane, Australia
    I know it works for most sliders in the Basic panel (not for Clarity/Vibrance/Saturation) but my understanding is that it did not work for the White Balance sliders until LR6. At least I have no memory of this being an option with LR4 and LR5 which is how far back my experience with LR goes.
     
  5. Ross the fiddler

    Ross the fiddler Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    I just tried an E-M5 photo I took of outdoors with CO8.3 & the Generic E-M5 ICC Profile made the image look a little yellow but choosing the E-M10 ICC Profile it wasn't. :confused-53: Anyhow, the Linear Response Curve made a difference, but I don't think it would or should be necessary as the WB Mode will default as Shot. In other words, what WB Mode you took the Shot in, so when I select sunny (in CO8) it cools the picture down to a suitable WB & Hue. I suggest trying that setting (i.e. select the setting for the appropriate scene in CO8 instead what the Auto shows) to override the camera's EXIF data that influences the Auto processing by CO8.

    BTW, how does the JPEG (or processed as is image in Olympus Viewer 3) look?
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2015
  6. Dragos101

    Dragos101 Mu-43 Regular

    68
    May 1, 2015
    Bucharest, Romania
    Dragos
    I also tried C1 with my EM10 and gave up after a LOT of advanced tweaking trying to not necessarily match the camera colors but to get a good balanced look. The colors are just off, the skin tones are bad. If you select the EM5II profile things get a little better but still don't match the Oly look which IMO is one of the main points of using this camera. I tried levels, curves, basic color, advanced color, and concluded that if a software needs such a large amount of work to get a good starting point it probably isn't the right tool. I have to admit I liked pretty much everything else about C1, the interface, the tools, the workflow.
    I use Lightroom (the camera natural profile is pretty close) with some color tweaks, but what got me REALLY close to the Oly look is a VSCO preset, the Kodak Portra 400. That with a few adjustments is my go to import preset and, IMO, 99% nails the Oly look.
     
  7. I think a lot of us got "tweaked" by trying our usual software...and when you saw the results you just looked and had a WTF moment. This has probably caused quite a bit of unrest amongst the Oly crowd. Give OV3 a try for RAW files. I tried it at first and hated it, but ended up coming back just to do noise removal and sharpening...and maybe some highlight/shadow adjustment...and that's it. Export to 16 bit tiff and then to your usual software. This may not be the ultimate approach, but it does work well.
     
  8. SojiOkita

    SojiOkita Mu-43 Top Veteran

    620
    Feb 23, 2014
    France
    I can't use OV3 because I don't want to process my Oly & Panny files with different software.
    In addition, I'm not a big fan of Oly colors & not a big fan of detail rendering (too much smoothing).
    (I'm talking about the JPEG files)

    Anyway... you made me curious so I will give it a try;)
     
  9. That makes absolute sense. But I will say, even though my M10 makes nice jpegs, I'll deal with the PIA OV3 just to get the nice rendering it does. Now I'll ask a stupid question because I assume you've tried some other camera settings to eliminate the yellow cast. Do you have the "Keep warm colors" filter turned on..Menu G near the bottom..? Just asking...I'm only here to help...LOL
     
  10. SojiOkita

    SojiOkita Mu-43 Top Veteran

    620
    Feb 23, 2014
    France
    I had this option turned off first (during several months), then on.
    (with Lightroom the E-M10 auto WB is almost always too cold even with the option ON).

    Anyway, that only affects the way the auto WB works.
    So as soon as you choose a manual or click white WB, that shouldn't be a problem.
    And the colors are off for all cases (auto WB, manual WB, keep warm colors or not).
     
  11. I guess I should be thankful that I only have the M10...even though I have some Canon files from the last few years. I gather that many Oly users have run into similar issues with trying to process files in their suite of choice...and had very mixed results. It kept bugging me though that some users were getting excellent results shooting RAW and using OV3. Once I accepted that this was what the Oly files wanted, I haven't looked back. I think shooting RAW actually becomes a simpler pathway.
     
  12. You might try and see if there's a trial version of ACDSee 8 Ultimate. I gather that there have been some Oly users happy with this software...and of course, it will work with your other files.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. SojiOkita

    SojiOkita Mu-43 Top Veteran

    620
    Feb 23, 2014
    France
    One important thing is that it will ne very difficult for me to use a raw software without local ajustements. I don't know if acdsee has this.

    I want to do all my processing in one software, all with parametric settings.
     
  14. I really don't know the answer to that. You might ask in one of the other forums here.
     
  15. I may have a workaround/fix for your issue. Lately I've noticed that same issue..color balance just a touch toward yellow. Working in OV3, you have two adjustments in the color temperature box..A for amber/blue and G for green/magenta. These same adjustments can be made in-camera and would thus be global. Try bringing both sliders down about 2 steps...moving toward the negative..and try shooting some fairly neutral color scenes and see what happens. This may get the M10 closer to the color balance of your other cameras without the hassle of doing this via software.
     
  16. Forgot to mention...these are available right on the SCP. And if it becomes a fix for only certain kinds of shooting, you can always incorporate those adjustments into a Set.
     
  17. Alright..I went out and did a few shots trying this and it worked pretty good. I dialed in 3 clicks negative for each. Results were subtle but noticeable when you A and B. Whites were cleaner and greens looked more like they should and not as yellowey. This goes for both jpeg and RAW files.
     
  18. GBarrington

    GBarrington Mu-43 Veteran

    I, for one think ACDSee Pro 8 and Ultimate 8 (same thing, except Ultimate does layers) do an excellent job with orf files not only with my E-M10, but my E30 as well. (PC only, The Mac version is at V3, it's not that popular, and there is no Ultimate version.)

    I'm not sure how well it works with Panasonic files. since I've never owned a Panasonic camera. But I do think ACDSee really 'gets' orf. I've written a few tutorials on my blog for ACDSee Pro and U8 that use *.orf files. I'm on blogspot if you are curious.

    (Just read a subsequent post re:Local adjustments, Pro 8 and Ultimate 8 both have extensive local adjustments. Both have a variety of Development brushes , Both introduced pixel targeting, and of course U8 has introduced a layering engine, it isn't any competition to Photoshop yet, or even PaintShop pro, but it does expand the usefulness and convenience significantly. V9 and V10 ought to be incredible!)
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2015
  19. GBarrington

    GBarrington Mu-43 Veteran

    FWIW, Windows only, ACDSee Ultimate 9, Pro 9, and ACDSee 19 were released last week. Major new features include (depending on which title one is talking about, but U9 has all of this)
    • X-Trans support (about time!)
    • Adjustment Layers
    • Automated lens corrections (Geometric and CA)
    • Snapshots (Virtual copies)
    • Action Recording and Playback
    • PS Plugin Support (I've already tested with Topaz Detail & Denoise - works fine)
    • Collections/Smart Collections - (Not sure of the difference yet, but the promo material makes a distinction)
    • Photos Mode - allows you to view entire photo database regardless of location
    • Dehaze - Is this a fad for the software publishers or what? What does this do that can't be done with other tools?
    • Skin Tune
    • 4K support
    • Lightroom Database conversion - I haven't tested, I got rid of my Lr database some time ago. But I suspect it does NOT Convert your Lr edits, but is more about metadata conversion issues.
    I wrote up my reactions to these features in an article on my blog, if you are interested: http://glenbarrington.blogspot.com/2015/09/an-experienced-users-notes-on-acdsee.html