Any Interest in DXO's PureRaw?

GBarrington

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I'm somewhat surprised there isn't much talk about this new product. It allows people who are happy, overall, with their current non-DXO workflow to take advantage of DXO Photolab's most useful features. (Deep Prime and the lens corrections, IMO). It works with ANY software that can read/develop linear DNG files. The product works great with ACDSee Ultimate and Affinity Photo, for example.

My testing indicates that it isn't perfect though, it can at times be a little too aggressive on some photos. Plus, it only works on RAW files, can't output to tif - just dng, and jpg. It also doesn't work on older camera files like the E500. When it works (which, TBF, is most of the time) it works quite well, but not being able to revisit older photos, and use it on bit mapped photo files, means one can't really get rid of the Topaz tools (or similar).

I'll probably buy it when the trial runs out, I don't think it is worth $130 US, but at the introductory price of $89 US, I think it is worth the money.
 
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mcasan

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I think this is an open challenge for Adobe to seriously update ACR/Develop to do a much better job. For those running M1 Macs, be aware that Pure Raw is only on x86 and will have to run on Rosetta. Running as a standalone, that should not be a problem.
 

Stanga

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As I am using Photolab 4 I don't have a need for PureRaw.
If you are unable to output to TIFF when using DeepPrime, you have a graphics card that is incompatible with the program. If you have a dual graphics card setup then try it with the 2nd card. That's how the problem is solved in Photolab at least. I would assume it to be the same for PureRaw.
 

GBarrington

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As I am using Photolab 4 I don't have a need for PureRaw.
If you are unable to output to TIFF when using DeepPrime, you have a graphics card that is incompatible with the program. If you have a dual graphics card setup then try it with the 2nd card. That's how the problem is solved in Photolab at least. I would assume it to be the same for PureRaw.
Unfortunately, it isn't the same. The help files and the User interface specifically exclude tif.
 

GBarrington

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I think this is an open challenge for Adobe to seriously update ACR/Develop to do a much better job. For those running M1 Macs, be aware that Pure Raw is only on x86 and will have to run on Rosetta. Running as a standalone, that should not be a problem.
This should also be an open challenge to ACDSee, and CaptureOne (the primary competitors to Lightroom). The last thing these guys should want is DXO developing a competent front end product. The pressure for them will be to incorporate these sorts of features because a complete integration of an entire DXO workflow would be very bad for them.

Just thinking blue sky here, but this could also be the end of all the brand specific products like Olympus Workspace and Nikon NXStudio. Depending on PureRaw's consumer acceptance, there could be pressure to open up such titles to process Linear DNGs as well as the Native files. We might see these products being sold to software publishers looking for front end products they don't have to build from the ground up.
 
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I'm very interested, because it's the only part of PhotoLab 4 that I'm actually into. I have the newest NIK stuff, and the rest I get from LR6 and On1. But it does oversharpen a lot of the time. I think we really need some sliders for opacity and strength. That would make PureRAW just what I need. Will I get it now? I'm testing it, I'll make that decision later on.
 

mcasan

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One reviewer suggested that It is a bad value. Better to purchase PhotoLab 4 and have much more control over the processing.
 

GBarrington

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One reviewer suggested that It is a bad value. Better to purchase PhotoLab 4 and have much more control over the processing.
I don't buy that argument! That really only makes sense if you are looking for a new raw processor. Changing your entire workflow just to get better denoising and auto-sharpening seems overkill to me. I LIKE my ACDSee centric workflow, I pretty much get the effects I am looking for with it. but I don't like its 'too basic' noise control tools.
 
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I don't buy that argument! That really only makes sense if you are looking for a new raw processor. Changing your entire workflow just to get better denoising and auto-sharpening seems overkill to me. I LIKE my ACDSee centric workflow, I pretty much get the effects I am looking for with it. but I don't like its 'too basic' noise control tools.
Photolab allows to generate linear dng for years...
I've used this feature first with Prime, then with DeepPrime, and it is really interesting to pre process your noisy pictures.
(and there's even a lightroom plugin)

From my point of view, the linear dng produced by photolab are much better than the one from pure raw, because you can choose the settings you prefer.

Pureraw files are overprocessed to my taste, with way too much sharpening - which is nonsense for a preprocessor.

This is only my point of view... the best thing is to try and compare both.
However, if you don't like Pureraw settings... you can't change them :)
 

RichardC

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If you want the benefits of Deepprime but don't want the sharpening (which is too much IMO), then PL4 Elite is the only way to get it.

I think DXO will sell a lot of PL4 Elite licences off the back of PureRaw trials, the 30% off code works on PL4E.

The cliche 'buy cheap, buy twice' particularly applies to all things to do with photography.
 
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Dxo products are almost always on sale anyway... if they aren't, just wait a few days :)

I find that DeepPrime is a really nice addition, I don't hesitate now to push a little the iso numbers when taking pictures.
However, it took me a lot of trials to find out which parameters I was satisfied with (and you don't necessarily need the same for landscape or portraits - in my case I found a "one size fits all" preset).

I would also mention that as the size of the images are multiplied by 3, you don't necessarily want to send all your images to dxo...
If you have a folder with 50 images, and you want to send 4 of them to dxo, it's way easier to do it with photolab's plugin than with pureraw (on windows :) on a mac drag and drop from lightroom seems to work).
 
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"On sale" is still pretty expensive for DXO software, the sale price for PL4 Elite is usually $200 or more. I don't think we need to take the cynical view that PureRAW is just a gateway for frustrated users to buy PL4, my hope is that they update it with some user control over the strength of settings.
 

GBarrington

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Dxo products are almost always on sale anyway... if they aren't, just wait a few days :)

I find that DeepPrime is a really nice addition, I don't hesitate now to push a little the iso numbers when taking pictures.
However, it took me a lot of trials to find out which parameters I was satisfied with (and you don't necessarily need the same for landscape or portraits - in my case I found a "one size fits all" preset).

I would also mention that as the size of the images are multiplied by 3, you don't necessarily want to send all your images to dxo...
If you have a folder with 50 images, and you want to send 4 of them to dxo, it's way easier to do it with photolab's plugin than with pureraw (on windows :) on a mac drag and drop from lightroom seems to work).
The thing is, not everyone uses Lr. On ACDSee, I could set up either DXO product as an external editor, and simply R-Click a selected image to send it to DXO(x) fo a round trip. That's how I would send an image to any 3rd party product.

True, drag and drop works for PureRaw but I'm used to this method, AND I can select multiple images for batch processing this way. That works like a champ. I suspect (but I don't know, I never tried, can someone try?) that Photolab's orientaion as a full service raw developer means that it likely prefers one image at a time.
 
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The thing is, not everyone uses Lr. On ACDSee, I could set up either DXO product as an external editor, and simply R-Click a selected image to send it to DXO(x) fo a round trip. That's how I would send an image to any 3rd party product.
It may also work with Ligthroom... I didn't try this method.

True, drag and drop works for PureRaw but I'm used to this method, AND I can select multiple images for batch processing this way. That works like a champ. I suspect (but I don't know, I never tried, can someone try?) that Photolab's orientaion as a full service raw developer means that it likely prefers one image at a time.
I mostly do batch conversion of 5-10 pictures at a time with PhotoLab.
It's really easy, even if you want to use several presets.

In theory, the workflow should be easier with PureRaw, though.
(however, the limitations on output folder & naming would induce 2 additional steps for me: rename the pictures + move them)
 
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"On sale" is still pretty expensive for DXO software, the sale price for PL4 Elite is usually $200 or more. I don't think we need to take the cynical view that PureRAW is just a gateway for frustrated users to buy PL4, my hope is that they update it with some user control over the strength of settings.
The price would be correct if they add some user control on some settings.
I hope it's not just designed to push users to buy Photolab... (frustrating users is not a very good strategy).

200€ is full price for PhotoLab Elite. I paid 100€ on black Friday sale... it's often at 150€.
However, what we don't know if the upgrade prices & interval.
With PhotoLab, upgrades are every year, and if you want new lenses... you need to upgrade (it's not just for new bodies).

I hope PureRAW will have longer paying update intervals & access to latests body/lenses combinations for all.
(for lots of software, on the long term, the sum of the upgrades cost more than the initial purchases...)
 

mcasan

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For me the upgrade to PL4 was as cheap as PR on sale. Much better to have the full PL.
 

GBarrington

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With PhotoLab, upgrades are every year, and if you want new lenses... you need to upgrade (it's not just for new bodies).
I didn't know that! I have cooled my ardor for PR with that knowledge.
I hope PureRAW will have longer paying update intervals & access to latests body/lenses combinations for all.
I suspect not. If it works for one product, it's likely to work for the others as well.
(for lots of software, on the long term, the sum of the upgrades cost more than the initial purchases...)
I suspect subscriptions make some more sense than they used to, at least for some people, for some software. I'm on subscription for ACDSee, it's a VERY modest annual cost, and it applies to all their photographic and video products. The biggest problem I can see is that going backwards to a permanent license can be expensive if I want to continue using the latest of just one or two products.

After consideration, I think Topaz's maintenance subscription concept is a good compromise. It sells you a permanent license, but ongoing support after the first year is optional and allows one to opt in or out as needed, without losing the permanent license.
 

OldRadioGuy

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PhotoLab 4 Elite's DeepPRIME has changed my attitude about ISO settings. For most work, I just set my Olympus cameras to auto, and then process the raw files in PL with DeepPRIME. Then it's out to a TIF for additional work. But now DxO PureRAW offers another choice.

PureRAW works well (most of the time) for my workflow: 1. Manage in Photo Mechanic Plus, 2. Open in DPR, 3. Send to Affinity Photo for finishing. I hope DxO will give us adjustment choices for both sharpening and lens correction. I agree that the PhotoRAW output is oversharpened sometimes. With my Olympus 8mm fisheye, lens correction is awful, but other lenses I've tested are OK.

But DPR is just another tool in the toolbox.
 

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