Another EP1 vs GF1 question

Discussion in 'This or That?' started by Jonkobeck, Aug 24, 2010.

  1. Jonkobeck

    Jonkobeck Mu-43 Regular

    100
    Jul 4, 2010
    New York City
    Let me pick your brains.
    I am looking at the EP1 and GF1 in a shop today. No matter which one I went with, I would want the fast 20mm pan lens. When this lens is mounted to the EP1 with the IS, does it gain 2 more stops(making it equal to 1.2) due to the in body IS?
    My concern is for indoor shooting in natural light.

    Also, is the image IQ equal on both these cameras? I don't care about color because I shoot raw and do my own post processing.
     
  2. Streetshooter

    Streetshooter Administrator Emeritus Subscribing Member Charter Member

    Dec 15, 2009
    Phila, Pa USA
    The jpeg output is better from the Pen cameras. The raw files from the Pens and the GF1 are almost identical. The IS doesn't really give you 2 more stops. What it does is stabilize the camera and because of this, you can hold steady at a slower speed. To be honest, I use the GF1 now with the 20 in very low light and I don't miss the stabilizer.
    It's nice to have but any shooter worth his pixels can do with out it.

    I have the Pen2 and the GF1 and think they are equals and not to compete with each other. They are both excellent machines that definitely do the job...
     
    • Like Like x 2
  3. Rudi

    Rudi Mu-43 Top Veteran

    574
    Aug 16, 2010
    Australia
    Yes, it does gain two stops, but equating it with having an f/1.2 lens is incorrect. It's more like having a wobbly tripod with you than a faster lens. :smile:
     
  4. crcal

    crcal Mu-43 Regular

    29
    Jul 21, 2010
    Honolulu, HI
    I've owned the E-P2, now own the GF1 with 20mm pancake. JPG's are nicer out of the Olympus, but I shoot RAW and they are both great as far as I can tell. The IBIS of the Olympus was great, but I find that I don't really miss it with the GF1 since it's a faster focusing camera. I almost felt like the E-P2 needed the IBIS since it took so long to take the photo, I had to hold the camera still longer. Your hand holding technique is key to being able to shoot at low shutter speeds.
     
  5. Streetshooter

    Streetshooter Administrator Emeritus Subscribing Member Charter Member

    Dec 15, 2009
    Phila, Pa USA
    I don't miss the IBIS either and that is a problem.
    I am running short on energy trying to keep the Pen2.
    If nothing else the AF system keeps me picking up the GF1....
    Torment...I tell ya torment.
     
  6. Grant

    Grant Mu-43 Veteran

    I am another person that doesn't miss Image Stabilization but for another reason. I have a huge arsenal of lens with my Nikon and none are IS. I have two lenses with for my Panasonic and one is IS. I don't use the IS as I know what I am capable of doing in a hand held situation and I don't want to confuse my personal shooting style. I have been shooting so long I get into a zone and only think of the finished product not the process. I do use tripods and monopods and at all times I carry a stringpod in my pocket. None of this is bad mouth IS it is just my style.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  7. Streetshooter

    Streetshooter Administrator Emeritus Subscribing Member Charter Member

    Dec 15, 2009
    Phila, Pa USA
    Grant,
    Just what we need around here....
    Someone who knows what their doing...
    Sheeeesh
     
  8. mav

    mav Mu-43 Regular

    58
    Aug 2, 2010
    Perth, Western Australia
    Real Name:
    Matt
    Regarding IS I was always under the impression that it was more useful for more narrow angle lenses where slight movements will result in greater travel.

    With a 20mm is that really a problem.

    Also being a pancake lens the whole camera will be more stable as you don't have a big tube hanging off the end of a relatively small body.

    There are people out their, mainly Canon users that swear by lens stabilisation over IBIS.

    In regards to choosing an EP1 or a GF1, the GF1 comes with a great lens which you'll get cheaper in a kit. The screen res is much better on the GF1 MF is easy with the screen. The advantages the olympus EVF fade away when we are talking about the EP1. I can't think of too many extra pluses it has, although it does look freaking awesome <3 the retro styling. I personally felt the control scheme on the GF1 was better too.

    You'd be best to just try each camera, if you are shooting in RAW they'll both be good.
     
  9. Streetshooter

    Streetshooter Administrator Emeritus Subscribing Member Charter Member

    Dec 15, 2009
    Phila, Pa USA
    Well, let's not sell the Pens short.
    There's a few features that are very well thought out....
    A few very important are....

    Lens reset. When switched to off....the camera stays focused at a preset distance until you refocus even if the camera is turned off and back on. It does not auto return to infinity. The GF1 doesn't do this important feature.

    AF/AEL button for AF lock...you can lock focus with the button and the camera stays focused there until you refocus. The GF1 doesn't do this either.
    On the Pens...this makes Hyper Focal distance work very easy...minus the scale of course.....
    The 2 above features do not have to be in MF mode... very important and useful.

    They both have their pluses and minuses and maybe someday, both will have the same features...but I doubt it.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  10. Mellow

    Mellow Mu-43 All-Pro

    Aug 27, 2010
    Florida or Idaho
    Real Name:
    Tom
    I was thinking about this yesterday, so I took a bunch of hand-held low-light shots with my EPL-1 and 20mm panny, trying to go as slow as I could go.

    I was amazed. While not all the shots were good, I caught several sharp ones at 1/4 second and one very sharp one at 1/2 second. Hand-held!

    I just can't imagine this would be possible without IBIS, especially not for my shaky hands.
     
  11. Rudi

    Rudi Mu-43 Top Veteran

    574
    Aug 16, 2010
    Australia
    Absolutely! I am one of those people. And, incidentally, a Canon shooter... :smile:

    In-lens IS will always be more effective, because it is optimised to that particular lens. But... I'd rather have IBIS than nothing! Is it absolutely essential? Nope, but if that is the only difference between two cameras that cost exactly the same amount, I'll always pick the camera with IBIS. Who wouldn't? (You can always turn it off... :wink: ).
     
  12. Jonkobeck

    Jonkobeck Mu-43 Regular

    100
    Jul 4, 2010
    New York City
    I have a G1 which I bought about a month ago from amazon for $480.00 which I thought was a good deal. I am planning to get the 20mm pancake, but was thinking if its wise to spend $400.00 on the lens when for about $750.00 I can get it with the Gf1 kit!

    Coming from a 5D, I appreciate the light weight and small size. I hardly ever carried the 5D with me. But in the last month of playing with the G1, its also a little awkward to have around my neck day in and day out. But after looking at the GF1, I am seeing that its not really all that much smaller then the G1! Of course I am using the G1 with the kit zoom.
    Soooooooo maybe I am thinking, the G1 with the pancake will be fine, almost as small as the GF1?
    decisions decisions

    PS- If i got the GF1 it would be for a daily carry around camera for street photos etc. I would use the GF1 for more critical work.
     
  13. Mellow

    Mellow Mu-43 All-Pro

    Aug 27, 2010
    Florida or Idaho
    Real Name:
    Tom
    G1 is bigger camera

    I have a G1 and an EPL-1 . . . IMO they're different cameras.

    The VF on the G1 is sure nice to have, but it makes the camera so much bulkier. Even with the 20mm f1.7 I can't fit it in my pocket like I can with the EPL-1 + 20mm (or you could with the GF-1 + 20mm)

    Don't get me wrong--the G1's not a big camera by any means. It's just not pocketable.
     
  14. everythingsablur

    everythingsablur Mu-43 Veteran

    412
    Aug 4, 2010
    Toronto, ON
    On the used market, I can find GF1 kits now for between $550-650 Canadian. Henry's (a big Canadian camera chain) has had auctions close this week for about $550. At those prices, it doesn't make sense to not buy a GF1 kit providing everything is in good condition.

    To some of my friends who have been looking at an Oly body and buying the 20mm pancake, it's now a $400 savings since they did not care for the Oly kit lens.
     
  15. trisberg

    trisberg Mu-43 Regular Charter Member

    69
    Apr 14, 2009
    That's one feature that made me pick the E-P2 over the GF-1 (the IBIS being the other). On my Canon DSLRs I always decoupled the focusing from the shutter button, using the * button for focusing. I like that you can configure the E-P1/2 the same way and use the AFL for focusing. I have mine configured to focus with the shutter button in AF mode and to focus with the AFL button in MF mode. Very handy.

    I defense of the GF-1, you can lock focus with the AF/AE LOCK button but you still have to focus with the shutter release button and you also have to remember that you locked focus and unlock it before trying to focus. Not as convenient IMO. And as you said, you also lose the ability to have focus fixed where it was when you turn the camera off and back on.

    -Thomas
     
  16. Ned

    Ned Mu-43 Legend

    Jul 18, 2010
    Alberta, Canada
    Wha-, no back-button focus on the GF-1? I'm a happy PEN user so it wasn't really a question, but that just sealed the deal for me that I will never switch. I don't own a single camera which isn't set to use back-button focus.

    I also avoid bodies without a multi-dial system like my E-3 and E-P1, although the Panasonic "push-dial" system seems pretty decent.

    All in all though, the E-P1 and E-P2 Pens are just more of an SLR-style camera in function to me, totally comparable to my E-3 in practical usage. In fact, I shoot professional product and model photoshoots with the E-P1 all the time (not as a preference, but when for whatever reason the E-3 isn't handy). It does all the same things in pretty much the same way, except I only wish it could do +/-5 EV compensation like the E-3.
     
  17. everythingsablur

    everythingsablur Mu-43 Veteran

    412
    Aug 4, 2010
    Toronto, ON
  18. Mrklaw

    Mrklaw New to Mu-43

    3
    Sep 27, 2010
    Windsor, UK
    I'm hearing the focus speed thing again. I thought with the latest firmware the EP's were much better. Is this just inertia from the previous experiences affecting people, or is the Olympus still poor in comparison? Was thinking of the GF1 for focus speed and better rear screen, but if the EP1 has much improved AF speed then I'd be tempted to go for that due to looks and the rear AF button option which I liked on my canon DSLR
     
  19. mauve

    mauve Mu-43 Top Veteran

    892
    Mar 9, 2010
    Paris, France
    Asking for AF speed of the E-P1 is like asking for the top speed of a Rolls Royce.

    The answer to both is "sufficient".
     
    • Like Like x 2
  20. panystac

    panystac Mu-43 Regular

    56
    Sep 14, 2010
    Tokyo, Japan

    You can do this by hitting the AF/AE lock button, after setting to yes in the menu.