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After a model shoot event, I disabled GX7 IBIS forever

Discussion in 'Panasonic Cameras' started by metalmania, Dec 7, 2013.

  1. metalmania

    metalmania Mu-43 Veteran

    244
    Jul 19, 2012
    NYC
    I went to a model shoot event, brought my E-M5, GX7 and 5D Mark II. I used 75/1.8 lens on GX7, later switched it onto E-M5. Let me say fortunately I switched it onto E-M5. In the similar lighting condition, with aroung 1/100s to 1/250s speed, most of the GX7 shots were out of focus due to the IBIS, while E-M5 shots with IBIS were mostly in focus. I used electronic shutter on GX7, so there was no shutter shock.

    However, this is purely just my experience, maybe the way I hold GX7 caused the IBIS conflict. It just didn't work for me. Disable the GX7 IBIS, I can get sharp pictures as long as the shutter speed is fast enough. I am not saying GX7 is bad, I still love it and use it...with IBIS off. :biggrin:

    Anyway, here are some shots with GX7 in that event.

    ggWKyfn.

    nNBV5Oo.

    s0duaZW.

    G76M6D6.
     
    • Like Like x 16
  2. rbelyell

    rbelyell Mu-43 Veteran

    356
    Sep 15, 2013
    Mountains of NY
    that camera has truly great skin tone. btw i cant use ibis on my epl5 either. inexcusable.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. oldracer

    oldracer Mu-43 All-Pro

    Oct 1, 2010
    USA
    IBIS has nothing to do with focus.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. burdickjp

    burdickjp Mu-43 Veteran

    235
    Feb 25, 2013
    I concur. Something else is going on. What else did you change?
     
  5. metalmania

    metalmania Mu-43 Veteran

    244
    Jul 19, 2012
    NYC
    Nothing. But why not IBIS? It's very possible that IBIS caused the camera shake and the focus was missed.
     
  6. heli-mech

    heli-mech Mu-43 Top Veteran

    959
    Mar 9, 2012
    Vancouver Island, Canada
    Andrew
    IBIS could possibly cause motion type blur but not focus misses. The sensor doesn't move back and forth, just side to side and up and down.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Dalton

    Dalton Mu-43 Veteran

    329
    Jan 24, 2010
    Portland, Oregon USA
    Dan Ferrall
    I am having great results with IBIS and the 75mm on my EPL-5. What are you finding "inexcusable?"
    Dan
     
  8. metalmania

    metalmania Mu-43 Veteran

    244
    Jul 19, 2012
    NYC
    Thanks! I didn't know that. So it is mostly blur looks like out-of-focus.
     
  9. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Apr 10, 2009
    Boston, MA (USA)
    I assume the models were still for these photos? Otherwise electronic shutter could be a culprit here.
     
  10. metalmania

    metalmania Mu-43 Veteran

    244
    Jul 19, 2012
    NYC
    They moved every 2 seconds. You mean electronic shutter is not useable for moving objects?

    Sent from my LT18i using Tapatalk 2
     
  11. oldracer

    oldracer Mu-43 All-Pro

    Oct 1, 2010
    USA
    Find a small bright spot, like a highlight in the model's eye. Enlarge it and study it. If you see a smear in a specific direction, that is camera motion. (edit: or subject motion) If it is just soft around the edges that is a focus error (or a soft lens).

    If you were shooting with strobes, you can automatically rule out camera (and sensor/IBIS) motion because the flash duration is short enough to freeze that kind of motion/to eliminate that possibility.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  12. Iceman73

    Iceman73 Mu-43 Rookie

    23
    Sep 9, 2012
    London
    sorry if this sounds silly (and I don't mean to offend the photographer) but why would you need ibis at 1/100 ot 1/250?
    Unless you're holding the camera with one hand? or the camera is too heavy with the lens and an external flash attached...
     
  13. Iceman73

    Iceman73 Mu-43 Rookie

    23
    Sep 9, 2012
    London
    Wow old racer, this is very valuable info for me. Thank you.
     
  14. Bokeaji

    Bokeaji Gonzo's Dad O.*

    Aug 6, 2011
    Austin, TX
    The camera has it. It should work. It shouldn't get in the way. He doesn't NEEDit.
     
  15. metalmania

    metalmania Mu-43 Veteran

    244
    Jul 19, 2012
    NYC
    Thanks! No flash was used in the event. I will check the eyes.

    Sent from my LT18i using Tapatalk 2
     
  16. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Apr 10, 2009
    Boston, MA (USA)
    I may be wrong, but that was my understanding. Otherwise we would use electronic shutter all the time.
     
  17. dadadude

    dadadude Mu-43 Regular

    156
    Jun 12, 2013
    San Carlos, CA
    David
    I guess I am the only one who doesn't see anything wrong with these images. They look fantastic to my old eyes. By the way my company did all the color corrections and retouching of the images for Banana Republic's advertising and outdoor campaigns for 12 years and also did Abercrombie & Fitch, Gap, Tommy Bahama and Swiss Army Victorinox for many years also. You should have seen the images we had to work with from the likes of Bruce Webber, Peggy Sirota, Carter Smith, Patrick Demarchelier, Tom Munro etc. I would have died and gone to heaven to get the IQ that the OP has shown here.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  18. heli-mech

    heli-mech Mu-43 Top Veteran

    959
    Mar 9, 2012
    Vancouver Island, Canada
    Andrew
    You are correct Amin, electronic shutter gives you the same "jello" rolling shutter effect as in movies when panning fast... If you try using the electronic shutter when panning or on a moving subject you will get obvious distortion, however I would not call it blur.

    Sent from my Samsung Note II via mu-43 app.
     
  19. oldracer

    oldracer Mu-43 All-Pro

    Oct 1, 2010
    USA
    The way an electronic shutter works is that it samples the sensor sequentially, top to bottom, and takes a considerable amount of time, maybe 1/10th of a second to do that. So, while each row's exposure will be whatever you have set (125th, 500th, etc.) the overall time to take the photo is much longer.

    This long photo-taking time (I'll avoid the ambiguous word "exposure.") can lead to issues with the photo. For example, if you are shooting under fluorescent light you will get 'banding" -- alternating rows of light and dark. This is because fluorescents turn on and off with the AC mains supply, 50 or 60 times a second, so will be on and off several times during the photo-taking period. If you count the bands and know your mains frequency, you can calculate the photo-taking time, in fact.

    You can also get distortion when shooting moving objects. For example, if you were taking a picture of a vertical pole that was moving quickly past you, it would appear as if it were slanted. The bottom (assuming the scan is from top to bottom) would be exposed much later than the top, so the bottom of the pole would appear to be ahead of the top. Similarly, if a car drove past, the wheels would appear to be elliptical, slanted backwards from the car's motion.

    Note that none of this is softness like focus problems or smears like camera/subject motion. The photos can be perfectly sharp but still there can be banding or distortion of moving objects.

    Personally, in a couple of thousand shots I have never used the electronic shutter in my GX-7. I'll probably play around with it someday but I really have no need for it that is strong enough to offset its shortcomings.

    Lots of words. Sorry. HTH.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  20. Ulfric M Douglas

    Ulfric M Douglas Mu-43 Hall of Famer

    Mar 6, 2010
    Northumberland
    Your four posted pics are all nice, but I suspect they aren't the ones with GX7 blur when IBIS was on.
    Can you post something that indicates what type of blur you were getting? A crop of an eye maybe.

    Is it akin to the kind of unsharpness sometimes given by the tiny Olympus bodies (e-pm2 etc) with their IBIS
    If so, the only solution (and simple) is to switch off IBIS for reasonable shutterspeeds, as I don't think the Panasonics have that convenient 1/8-sec anti-shock option which can cure it for some users.