‘Olympus Has Not Fallen’ AP Interview Mark Thackara Marketing Olympus UK

[Equable]

I spoke to a friend in the world of (offshore) finance about the Olympus announcement the other day. He was vaguely aware of it, and added that large Japanese businesses are regarded as notorious for inefficiencies due to “loss of face”. He said that JIP, although Japanese as well, being a private equity company, would be keen to show returns on any investment made. He would make no predictions as to how this would be accomplished, but they are in it for the bottom line.
A couple of beers over a quick lunch and a quick chat prove nothing of course, but it was interesting to get another perspective from someone who has no iron in the fire.

 

[demiro]

After reading all the negative comments, I am left to wonder how did all these photographic experts get conned into buying Olympus in the first place? I think that everyone should vote with their pocketbook. If you don't like it, sell it and buy something else. If you like it and it fits your style, keep it and continue pushing the shutter button and marveling at the digital images that seem to just keep coming from the gear. My thoughts are that it has been a huge waste of time to ponder "what-ifs" when "what is" is just waiting to be used.

That of course is a true statement, but the idea that it is a waste of time escapes me. 90% of the "content" here could be classified as a waste of time, imo, but yet we still all hang out here and "talk". Why? It's fun on some level to engage with others about our hobby. Given the current state of Olympus it seems obvious there'd be a lot of discussion about it.

 

[demiro]

You mean the marketing manager for Olympus is coming out and sales are great and everything is rosey? I am shocked. </s>
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[MichailK]

gosh, all threads move too fast these days, I cannot keep up, getting slower as I age

I agree that marketing has to be better, but really wonder how have you missed the greatness of E-M10 II. When I studied ILC market in 2016 and opted for that camera, it was very clear that it almost matched E-M5 II, basically just no weather-sealing, video output etc. Although I do study internet A LOT when investing in something more expensive.

my general feel from the reviews back in 2016 when I started to feel the E-PL5&VF-4 do not serve me well enough was that the
E-PL5(rangefinderesque)=E-M10ii(dslresque) besides the revised ibis and different ergonomics and that I had to go higher to get something really better

I don’t think you appreciate the cost & value of these cameras. It also sounded like you just bought on marketing rather then checking the full specs & reviews. Also the PEN-F was a premium camera with a new 20MP sensor etc, not an entry level EPL.

I am no longer the bright smart-@$h mind I used to be but I would not classify me as a dummy, at least yet - however in 2014, coming in the system after a decade of a kodak bridge camera and carrying an anemic wallet I did my best to invest my dimes in the best possible system for the long run - too lucky my Samsung NX20 fire sale order fell through the cracks of a local retailer (I was so angry when they told me “sorry” but they also carried my 2nd choice, the E-PL5 so I went with this)

I was impressed by the PenF leaflets but I immediately saw they wanted to upsell the item by quite a lot - also no PenF available in local shops to touch and asses with one’s own fingers

all the above point to ”improve marketing messaging” in my eyes

The pleasure of using PEN-F really surprised me, the camera feels so good.

MichailK has a bit of a conflict there in points 2. & 3. Complaining about the price of PEN-F (great metal build quality), while saying plastic E-M5 III is too expensive for the build quality.

( after years of drooling, a practically new X100T found its way in my bag last week - how does the PenF compare, haptically?)

The PenF surely looks nice but if it was any cheaper in its built, maybe even plastic body+metal plates and not upsold as much as it was as a lifestyle object, couldn’t it have a price tag lower by maybe 2(3?) hundred less eurodollars and suddenly pop-up in very many consumer radars that dismissed it at first? I feel that bundled properly, it could even had drawn newcomers in the system the way the X100 series have been doing.

I am of the opinion that the E-M5iii is too plastic for the price: When I dropped the M10ii on its left top back edge a couple of months ago, the metal plate corner was deformed a bit at the corner edge only but the underlying plastic body threw away a tiny plastic chip almost leaving a small hole exactly under the top plate. Fortunately, the top plate is getting deep enough in the body so no hole appeared and some glue put the fragment back in place so perfectly I could say it never happened.
But I am 100% sure that if it was a plastic top plated M10iii or this new M5iii I would have had to send it to Athens to be flown to Belgium (I think) for a new top plate, minimum, and wait three weeks before using it again. Glad for the M10ii top plate, it saved the day. Here, the metal plated M10ii was 400 euros last July and the M5iii sells now for 1250 euros, body only. No, I am not considering getting this quality plastic at this price point, ever.

so again, in my eyes: ”ïmprove marketing messaging” and pricing/value equation

 

[MichailK]

‘Olympus Has Not Fallen’

however, I must point out that today I could not see the mountain region at the extreme end of the valley - too foggy!
so it has not fallen but it surely lost its way in the fog

 

[tkbslc]

I spoke to a friend in the world of (offshore) finance about the Olympus announcement the other day. He was vaguely aware of it, and added that large Japanese businesses are regarded as notorious for inefficiencies due to “loss of face”. He said that JIP, although Japanese as well, being a private equity company, would be keen to show returns on any investment made. He would make no predictions as to how this would be accomplished, but they are in it for the bottom line.
A couple of beers over a quick lunch and a quick chat prove nothing of course, but it was interesting to get another perspective from someone who has no iron in the fire.

All large businesses in every country are notorious for inefficiencies. It's almost guaranteed to happen as you scale to large. Has little to do with being Japanese.

 

[tkbslc]

however, I must point out that today I could not see the mountain region at the extreme end of the valley - too foggy!
so it has not fallen but it surely lost its way in the fog

We've got a mount Olympus here in Utah as well. I just checked on it and it is still there.

 

[MichailK]

We've got a mount Olympus here in Utah as well. I just checked on it and it is still there.

Ha! Ours is not only the original, it is also taller! You need an FF camera to take a full photo!

 

[tkbslc]

Ha! Ours is not only the original, it is also taller! You need an FF camera to take a full photo!

It must be cool to live in a place with so much history. This area I’m in was settled in 1847. Before that it was empty desert with the occasional nomadic tribe wandering through. We aren’t the original for anything around here.

 

[Ross the fiddler]

It must be cool to live in a place with so much history. This area I’m in was settled in 1847. Before that it was empty desert with the occasional nomadic tribe wandering through. We aren’t the original for anything around here.

I don't want to get political here, but it was inhabited beforehand though, just like it was in Australia (by 46,000 years).

 

[John King]

I don't want to get political here, but it was inhabited beforehand though, just like it was in Australia (by 46,000 years).

Ross, its my understanding that humans only got to the Americas during or after the last ice age.

The Australian Aboriginals appear to have shown up in three major waves - 65,000 -80,000 years ago, ~45,000 years ago and around 5,000 years ago. The last group bringing the dingo with them, an unmitigated disaster for most ground dwelling or low nesting birds and most small mammals.

Like all of us humans, our forebears have had an unhealthy impact on the environment. We are now in plague proportions.

Maybe SARS COVID-19 will sort that out ...

 

[MichailK]

hey guys, I was just trying to mock FF lust here!!

 

[pdk42]

For those interested - here is the UK e-group zoom recording with Mark Thackara.

There's a cameo appearance from me starting at about 16mins 50 secs.

 

[Ross the fiddler]

For those interested - here is the UK e-group zoom recording with Mark Thackara.

There's a cameo appearance from me starting at about 16mins 50 secs.

Yes, & I viewed it today & saw your contribution.

 

[Robstar1963]

For those interested - here is the UK e-group zoom recording with Mark Thackara.

There's a cameo appearance from me starting at about 16mins 50 secs.

Thanks for posting @pdk42 ?
Looking forward to watching the next one in 4-5 weeks if it goes ahead if you don’t mind posting it up
I took some reassurance from this with regard to ongoing Warranty cover and facilities being maintained

 

[211Oakland]

Amateur MBAing is always tough.

I'd be interested to know about Oly sales in the UK.

In Japan last year, the E-PL9 was the best selling mirrorless camera. https://www.cameraegg.org/olympus-e-pl9-best-seller-in-mirrorless-camera-sales-of-february-2020/ I dunno if that's a "lifestyle" camera or not, but it is a successful camera.

Oly marketing here in the USA has been pretty aggressive with sales of late, and now they're running a trade in program, basically a way to switch from other brands and get a hefty discount on the new OMDs. Not sure how generous the trade in is though. But still, they're making efforts to sell. My local camera shop was still planning to continue with them.

 

[demiro]

For those interested - here is the UK e-group zoom recording with Mark Thackara.

There's a cameo appearance from me starting at about 16mins 50 secs.

Are you the guy saying output from E-PL5 matched his Canon 5D?

 

[pdk42]

Are you the guy saying output from E-PL5 matched his Canon 5D?

I said it was close. Same sensor in EPL5 as the EM5.

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[demiro]

I said it was close. Same sensor in EPL5 as the EM5.

I assumed you were judging by your photos, not DXOMark.

I was a big fan of the E-PL5, and a much bigger fan of the E-M5. But neither, imo, hold a candle to the old Canon 5D. I only ever shot the 5D with lower-end lenses (no Ls), and found the images to be quite special. What does that mean? I don't know exactly - pop; micro-contrast...? I'm not good at spelling out the why. The only edge I can give to the E-M5 would be hand-held stills in low light, where the IBIS allowed for shots the 5D could never capture.

Again, I was very happy with those Oly cameras, usually shooting with the 17/1.8 or 45/1.8 . No complaints. I just can't begin to equate the image quality to what I saw from the 5D. And I ultimately went with size/cost/performance of m4/3s over bulk/higher price/noticeably better IQ of FF. m4/3s was generally "good enough" for me, but not really close to FF in my eyes.

 

[pdk42]

I assumed you were judging by your photos, not DXOMark.

I was a big fan of the E-PL5, and a much bigger fan of the E-M5. But neither, imo, hold a candle to the old Canon 5D. I only ever shot the 5D with lower-end lenses (no Ls), and found the images to be quite special. What does that mean? I don't know exactly - pop; micro-contrast...? I'm not good at spelling out the why. The only edge I can give to the E-M5 would be hand-held stills in low light, where the IBIS allowed for shots the 5D could never capture.

Again, I was very happy with those Oly cameras, usually shooting with the 17/1.8 or 45/1.8 . No complaints. I just can't begin to equate the image quality to what I saw from the 5D. And I ultimately went with size/cost/performance of m4/3s over bulk/higher price/noticeably better IQ of FF. m4/3s was generally "good enough" for me, but not really close to FF in my eyes.

I only quoted the DxO marks to substantiate my view. I found DxO much later than when I was running them both. As regards the differences - I can see what you're saying. There was a certain "je ne sais quoi" about the 5D - but in landscape shots (my main interest) that effect is diminished and TBH the little E-PL5 was not in any significant way inferior. In fact, in some ways the opposite since pushing shadows on 5D files would reveal horrible banding that was absent on the Olympus camera (with its Sony sensor!).